You know why he wont play a korean mmorpg instead of darkfall once the grind will get fixed, because in a korean mmorpg, you cant go back to starter town only to kill lvl 1 players. This is what he want. He want to kill noobs for ever in darkfall. Even after 2 months of play, he want to see them as noobs and stomp pwn them. He fear the challenge.
We just don't want quitters and those who can't stand having long term goals to ruin gameplay.
When in fact many players have been requesting for months to reduce the grind to increase PvP in a PVP GAME. Reducing Grind does NOT ruin gameplay, it enhances it by sending more "PvP-ready" players out in the field so that everyone can actually enjoy good PvP across Agon.
And most players have been asking for more incentive to PvP....in a PvP game....go figure....
You know why he wont play a korean mmorpg instead of darkfall once the grind will get fixed, because in a korean mmorpg, you cant go back to starter town only to kill lvl 1 players. This is what he want. He want to kill noobs for ever in darkfall. Even after 2 months of play, he want to see them as noobs and stomp pwn them. He fear the challenge.
We just don't want quitters and those who can't stand having long term goals to ruin gameplay.
When in fact many players have been requesting for months to reduce the grind to increase PvP in a PVP GAME. Reducing Grind does NOT ruin gameplay, it enhances it by sending more "PvP-ready" players out in the field so that everyone can actually enjoy good PvP across Agon.
And most players have been asking for more incentive to PvP....in a PvP game....go figure....
Good post. Players like darth raiden know that. They only want to whine about the upcoming change because they dont want to get stomp pwned by 1-3 months old players. They know that they wont be able to win 1 vs 3 soon, so they start fearing us newb's that will be viable pretty quick and populate DF with over 5k active players in one server. He fear that the world of DF politic will become Anarchy.
You know why he wont play a korean mmorpg instead of darkfall once the grind will get fixed, because in a korean mmorpg, you cant go back to starter town only to kill lvl 1 players. This is what he want. He want to kill noobs for ever in darkfall. Even after 2 months of play, he want to see them as noobs and stomp pwn them. He fear the challenge.
We just don't want quitters and those who can't stand having long term goals to ruin gameplay.
When in fact many players have been requesting for months to reduce the grind to increase PvP in a PVP GAME. Reducing Grind does NOT ruin gameplay, it enhances it by sending more "PvP-ready" players out in the field so that everyone can actually enjoy good PvP across Agon.
And most players have been asking for more incentive to PvP....in a PvP game....go figure....
Good post. Players like darth raiden know that. They only want to whine about the upcoming change because they dont want to get stomp pwned by 1-3 months old players. They know that they wont be able to win 1 vs 3 soon, so they start fearing us newb's that will be viable pretty quick and populate DF with over 5k active players in one server. He fear that the world of DF politic will become Anarchy.
Real and Madness, what you need to understand is that my expectation if i join a MMORPG is to find people at various stage of progression, some will have lower skills other will have higher skills and prob few will have max skills and others will differs in skills. Thats MMORPG core, and no it isnt i want defend my "uber skills" cause i played no macro and casual over the last year. Myself i am happy to have goals and i would not mind if i needed years to get to my "completed char" (if something like that exist in an MMORPG at all).
What you and others suggest will put many chars in a fraction of time at some "max stage of development" .No i don't mean the hp change coming this expac, i mean the mindset behind all this demands for changes . I know this mindset from previous MMO's , people intrested in max char was just duelling the whole day as soon as they reached what they thought is a "completed PvP char" and you could forget them in regards to "playing" the game and participating in clan activities if it wasn't sieges and clan fights. I just forsee if the changes go down the road the mainstream demands we have prob a lot more player hanging around in player cities and logging in for sieges and stuff, because they will have their "pvp ready char" and the status on map will be about the same.
Btw what is these "PvP ready" talk. It is a "worldy" world and not some arena.Some fights with people you will meet in the field you will will win some fights you will loose. Most fights will never account you as a single fighter cause you will face groups of various people and sizes and even if you have good skills you loose. A "worldy" world is not fair and you will loose a lot of times. There is no balance in it and there shouldn't be one.
-----MY-TERMS-OF-USE-------------------------------------------------- $OE - eternal enemy of online gaming -We finally WON !!!! 2011 $OE accepted that they have been fired 2005 by the playerbase and closed down ridiculous NGE !!
"There was suppression of speech and all kinds of things between disturbing and fascistic." Raph Koster (parted $OE)
What you need to understand is that grinding is not the only form of Character Progression, especially in Sandbox Games, this is not currently the case in DarkFall, the only way to progress is to grind.
To use Trashburnin's expression where he claims that players asking for a reduced grind simply because they were" poisoned" by the WoW mentality, it's actually the opposite around. Both you and him see grinding as the only way to Progress in a Sandbox MMORPG. Then again, it's understandable considering the lack of lore or anything else in DarkFall at the moment, but it is still possible to progress in the game through your actions, create your own story, etc. It's a sandbox FFA PvP MMO dammit, not a WoW-let's-grind-to-80-as-soon-as-possible-so-we-can-join-the-end-game.
How exactly does having more people to pvp with ruin your pvp experience again?
I'm missing something important. Can you really not have fun killing these guys? Does it really eat you up knowing it didn't take them as long to pvp as it took you?
I can't see this is anyone's problem except your own disfunctional psyche.
- or -
Is it that you think DF is suppose to be unfair. And the devs have made it fair. And you are complaining because the way devs are treating you isn't fair?
Hmmm.....i'm still left with the disfunctional psyche conclusion.
How exactly does having more people to pvp with ruin your pvp experience again?
I'm missing something important. Can you really not have fun killing these guys? Does it really eat you up knowing it didn't take them as long to pvp as it took you?
I can't see this is anyone's problem except your own disfunctional psyche.
- or -
Is it that you think DF is suppose to be unfair. And the devs have made it fair. And you are complaining because the way devs are treating you isn't fair?
Hmmm.....i'm still left with the disfunctional psyche conclusion.
i am afraid it will never be "fair" and because you and others will never understand that the next wave of crying will come for sure..
-----MY-TERMS-OF-USE-------------------------------------------------- $OE - eternal enemy of online gaming -We finally WON !!!! 2011 $OE accepted that they have been fired 2005 by the playerbase and closed down ridiculous NGE !!
"There was suppression of speech and all kinds of things between disturbing and fascistic." Raph Koster (parted $OE)
How exactly does having more people to pvp with ruin your pvp experience again?
I'm missing something important. Can you really not have fun killing these guys? Does it really eat you up knowing it didn't take them as long to pvp as it took you?
I can't see this is anyone's problem except your own disfunctional psyche.
- or -
Is it that you think DF is suppose to be unfair. And the devs have made it fair. And you are complaining because the way devs are treating you isn't fair?
Hmmm.....i'm still left with the disfunctional psyche conclusion.
i am afraid it will never be "fair" and because you and others will never understand that the next wave of crying will come for sure..
No one is asking for it to be 100% fair. But so that at least when you win a 1vs5 fight (you being the loner), you can say that it's because you were really skilled. Not because you spammed 5 AoE Magic and everyone's dead. The sole purpose of reducing the grind is to shorten the gap between Vets and New players, not to the extent where a new player can destroy a vet in a single day, but at least make it so that instead of taking 6 months to be able to hold your grounds in a 1vs1 situation, it should take 2 months. It's a reasonable timeline for a PVP GAME.
I mean seriously, I've seen a single player raid Hammerdale and just kill everyone without actually trying....how fun is that? 1vs20 and he still wons, not because the new players sucks, but because there's no way for them to fight back! "Just stand there and make it short so we can move on and go back to grinding"....where's the fun in that?
You know why he wont play a korean mmorpg instead of darkfall once the grind will get fixed, because in a korean mmorpg, you cant go back to starter town only to kill lvl 1 players. This is what he want. He want to kill noobs for ever in darkfall. Even after 2 months of play, he want to see them as noobs and stomp pwn them. He fear the challenge.
We just don't want quitters and those who can't stand having long term goals to ruin gameplay.
When in fact many players have been requesting for months to reduce the grind to increase PvP in a PVP GAME. Reducing Grind does NOT ruin gameplay, it enhances it by sending more "PvP-ready" players out in the field so that everyone can actually enjoy good PvP across Agon.
And most players have been asking for more incentive to PvP....in a PvP game....go figure....
Good post. Players like darth raiden know that. They only want to whine about the upcoming change because they dont want to get stomp pwned by 1-3 months old players. They know that they wont be able to win 1 vs 3 soon, so they start fearing us newb's that will be viable pretty quick and populate DF with over 5k active players in one server. He fear that the world of DF politic will become Anarchy.
Real and Madness, what you need to understand is that my expectation if i join a MMORPG is to find people at various stage of progression, some will have lower skills other will have higher skills and prob few will have max skills and others will differs in skills. Thats MMORPG core, and no it isnt i want defend my "uber skills" cause i played no macro and casual over the last year. Myself i am happy to have goals and i would not mind if i needed years to get to my "completed char" (if something like that exist in an MMORPG at all).
What you and others suggest will put many chars in a fraction of time at some "max stage of development" .No i don't mean the hp change coming this expac, i mean the mindset behind all this demands for changes . I know this mindset from previous MMO's , people intrested in max char was just duelling the whole day as soon as they reached what they thought is a "completed PvP char" and you could forget them in regards to "playing" the game and participating in clan activities if it wasn't sieges and clan fights. I just forsee if the changes go down the road the mainstream demands we have prob a lot more player hanging around in player cities and logging in for sieges and stuff, because they will have their "pvp ready char" and the status on map will be about the same.
Btw what is these "PvP ready" talk. It is a "worldy" world and not some arena.Some fights with people you will meet in the field you will will win some fights you will loose. Most fights will never account you as a single fighter cause you will face groups of various people and sizes and even if you have good skills you loose. A "worldy" world is not fair and you will loose a lot of times. There is no balance in it and there shouldn't be one.
Darth, you playing a PvP game. In PvP, there is no real long term character progression. Long term character progression exists mostly (around 95%) on PvE side.
Darkfall is a pvp game. I don't want to spend half a year to BEGIN being competitive. I can play Call of Duty and be competitive at day 1. But someone who played a year in CoD will have a small advantage, perks, map knowledge, ect.
Sounds to me like real pvp'ers would WELCOME this change. You get more compitition. I don't hear whining from the OP, I hear fear. You spent all this time making sure you had a significant advantage over most players. What you are saying is that you are scared to fight on a level field, and rely on your own skill to make you better.
I tried Darkfall. Saw how fun the pvp and sieges could be, then disputed the credit card transaction and unsubbed after my first 30 days. Why? I didn't want to spend months of time watching OTHER people have fun while I worked. If I wanted to do that I'd get a job at Disney World sweeping floors. It takes maybe 2 months to become competitive at WoW. During that time you do some fun quests, dungeons, ect. In darkfall you afk macro and spam the same skills over, and over, then over again, and a few more times after that, only for 12 months.
Darkfall is a pvp game. I don't want to spend half a year to BEGIN being competitive. I can play Call of Duty and be competitive at day 1. But someone who played a year in CoD will have a small advantage, perks, map knowledge, ect.
Sounds to me like real pvp'ers would WELCOME this change. You get more compitition. I don't hear whining from the OP, I hear fear. You spent all this time making sure you had a significant advantage over most players. What you are saying is that you are scared to fight on a level field, and rely on your own skill to make you better.
I tried Darkfall. Saw how fun the pvp and sieges could be, then disputed the credit card transaction and unsubbed after my first 30 days. Why? I didn't want to spend months of time watching OTHER people have fun while I worked. If I wanted to do that I'd get a job at Disney World sweeping floors. It takes maybe 2 months to become competitive at WoW. During that time you do some fun quests, dungeons, ect. In darkfall you afk macro and spam the same skills over, and over, then over again, and a few more times after that, only for 12 months.
The issue I feel is that for over a year the True Darkfall fans have been forced to do this Mindless grind. They have put hours and hours of hardcore gamer Sweat and BLood into this game. If they make changes to reduce all of that, its like a kick in the balls to all those gamers who deserve what they earned.
This is a MMORPG, not a first person shooter CoD. I am all for bridging the gap for all your FPS players but if they reduced the grind too much I would probably hate the game for making me spend all that money for something that could have cost half the price to get. I think the darkfall devs know this and will do the right thing. They said they are only making minor changes to bridge the gap in the Hitpoints area.
The issue I feel is that for over a year the True Darkfall fans have been forced to do this Mindless grind. They have put hours and hours of hardcore gamer Sweat and BLood into this game. If they make changes to reduce all of that, its like a kick in the balls to all those gamers who deserve what they earned.
This is a MMORPG, not a first person shooter CoD.
Erm, are you suppose to be the defender of the grind with statements like that?
So you agree the game is a mindless grind, and we have to put hours upon hours of sweat and blood to play this game. And the tiny population that manage to survive the months of macroing and grinding deserve what we have earned? You have to be a troll to say they have to keep it like this and never get another new player to the game.
Ohh, and what have we earned, what work? I play civ 4 and Darkfall on two accounts at the moment. I think when I play civ4, Darkfall plays itself. I sometimes glance at the other monitor to see if I get a GM call, that`s all. So you grinders really think time and nothing but time should be the factor in this pvp mmo? Jesus, no wonder the population is low.
And we know this isn`t a first person shooter, you can stop telling us this. FPS games have 50 million players, we have 5 k.
The issue I feel is that for over a year the True Darkfall fans have been forced to do this Mindless grind. They have put hours and hours of hardcore gamer Sweat and BLood into this game. If they make changes to reduce all of that, its like a kick in the balls to all those gamers who deserve what they earned.
This is a MMORPG, not a first person shooter CoD. I am all for bridging the gap for all your FPS players but if they reduced the grind too much I would probably hate the game for making me spend all that money for something that could have cost half the price to get. I think the darkfall devs know this and will do the right thing. They said they are only making minor changes to bridge the gap in the Hitpoints area.
Thats it.
I didn't hear much QQ when they increase the Skill Gain by 6x on Monsters for Magic (3x on players) and 3x on Monsters and Players for Melee/Archery. Beside, it's common knowledge that a large portion of the vets macro'ed their way up and far too many people do macro their way up these days too.
Unless you want to keep playing Fantasy-style EVE with Offline Skill Progression, I really don't see why people would complain about reducing the grind. As I said, you're basically increasing the amount of PvP and at the same time bringing more challenges for Vets, who won't be as bored as they currently are.
you're basically increasing the amount of PvP and at the same time bringing more challenges for Vets
Making things more challenging for Vets?
But what would the wolves do without sheep to slaughter? They'd starve!
They're already starving because they ate most of the sheeps. Reducing the grind, making the game more PvP-focused and a lot more fun means that more "sheeps" will join. This is one of the major issue that new players have with DarkFall, the need to grind for 6 month before actually being able to PvP when they joined DarkFall as it was advertised as a FFA PvP MMO, when in fact, it's more of a PvE game with PvP End-Game.
Reducing the grind means that DarkFall will bring a lot more players to Agon, effectively bringing both more sheeps for wolves to feeds on and more PvP for players looking for actions. It's what Aventurine needs to do to bring more subs,make the game a lot more interesting, and closer to what we were promised when we purchased DarkFall: A FFA PvP MMO. Not some PvE MMO with end-game PvP, there's plenty of those on the market already.
Beside, the PvE isn't all that hard. Heck, ever fought the Devil? Just spawn some Battlehorns in front of him and spam his ass with archery or Magic.....god that's hard.
you're basically increasing the amount of PvP and at the same time bringing more challenges for Vets
Making things more challenging for Vets?
But what would the wolves do without sheep to slaughter? They'd starve!
They're already starving because they ate most of the sheeps. Reducing the grind, making the game more PvP-focused and a lot more fun means that more "sheeps" will join. This is one of the major issue that new players have with DarkFall, the need to grind for 6 month before actually being able to PvP when they joined DarkFall as it was advertised as a FFA PvP MMO, when in fact, it's more of a PvE game with PvP End-Game.
Reducing the grind means that DarkFall will bring a lot more players to Agon, effectively bringing both more sheeps for wolves to feeds on and more PvP for players looking for actions. It's what Aventurine needs to do to bring more subs,make the game a lot more interesting, and closer to what we were promised when we purchased DarkFall: A FFA PvP MMO. Not some PvE MMO with end-game PvP, there's plenty of those on the market already.
Beside, the PvE isn't all that hard. Heck, ever fought the Devil? Just spawn some Battlehorns in front of him and spam his ass with archery or Magic.....god that's hard.
Yay some valid points The wolves were starving already when i played DF and it was some months ago. Thats why i hear by my old guilds mates that more often aswell vets leave DF out of boredom.
My main concern is that i dont see how AV want to get turn around for DF. I simply dont see how they want to manage it if they go on like before. Yeah they got spotlight forum now, but the info there is more "vague" then accurate and people arent smarter after reading them.
I think DF will exist till another game with full loot FFA PVP comes by and makes it better. Right now they got more or less a monopol on this niche, which kinda sux.
you're basically increasing the amount of PvP and at the same time bringing more challenges for Vets
Making things more challenging for Vets?
But what would the wolves do without sheep to slaughter? They'd starve!
They're already starving because they ate most of the sheeps. Reducing the grind, making the game more PvP-focused and a lot more fun means that more "sheeps" will join. This is one of the major issue that new players have with DarkFall, the need to grind for 6 month before actually being able to PvP when they joined DarkFall as it was advertised as a FFA PvP MMO, when in fact, it's more of a PvE game with PvP End-Game.
Reducing the grind means that DarkFall will bring a lot more players to Agon, effectively bringing both more sheeps for wolves to feeds on and more PvP for players looking for actions. It's what Aventurine needs to do to bring more subs,make the game a lot more interesting, and closer to what we were promised when we purchased DarkFall: A FFA PvP MMO. Not some PvE MMO with end-game PvP, there's plenty of those on the market already.
Beside, the PvE isn't all that hard. Heck, ever fought the Devil? Just spawn some Battlehorns in front of him and spam his ass with archery or Magic.....god that's hard.
Yay some valid points The wolves were starving already when i played DF and it was some months ago. Thats why i hear by my old guilds mates that more often aswell vets leave DF out of boredom.
My main concern is that i dont see how AV want to get turn around for DF. I simply dont see how they want to manage it if they go on like before. Yeah they got spotlight forum now, but the info there is more "vague" then accurate and people arent smarter after reading them.
I think DF will exist till another game with full loot FFA PVP comes by and makes it better. Right now they got more or less a monopol on this niche, which kinda sux.
A 5k players monopoly ain't that great (Number ain't 100% accurate) when compared to the 200k players who wanted to buy the pre-order back in Feb of 2009 :P
How exactly does having more people to pvp with ruin your pvp experience again?
I'm missing something important. Can you really not have fun killing these guys? Does it really eat you up knowing it didn't take them as long to pvp as it took you?
I can't see this is anyone's problem except your own disfunctional psyche.
- or -
Is it that you think DF is suppose to be unfair. And the devs have made it fair. And you are complaining because the way devs are treating you isn't fair?
Hmmm.....i'm still left with the disfunctional psyche conclusion.
i am afraid it will never be "fair" and because you and others will never understand that the next wave of crying will come for sure..
Ah, I see your point. It will never be fair to you because they insist on making the game fair. The only fair way to treat you is to give you an unfair advantage. I can see how hurt you must be. "It is unfair to me that I don't have an unfair advantage". Great argument. You got me.
Although your response only tangently had something to do with mine, I'll show you how reading comprehension works:
1. Gamers you 'label' whiners complained about being treated unfairly, i.e. the First Wave of Crying
2. Developers made a change to get them closer to a competitive battlefield.
3. So you complained about being treated unfairly, i.e. the NEXT wave of crying
Logically, this means it is not I, who started 'the next wave of crying', it is you.
I have no complaints about DF, as I don't play it. I'm trying to make logical sense of your argument but you haven't presented a cogent argument and seem to not understand how illogical your argument sounds. But thanks for blaming its problems on someone who never has and never will play it.
My conclusions are out of logic:
A. You levelled before there was a large highly skilled population to trounce you as you skilled up.
B. Players now have a large highly skilled population trouncing new players as they skill up.
C. Ergo, your experience in skilling up did not have the major barrier that these 'whiners' did.
D. Ergo, you don't have a right to speak about what these players are dealing with, as you never had to deal with it in the quantities they have.
Hey, but if you get your way, and things stay the same, you can rest assured that each new player would skill up through an atmosphere you never had to deal with. More challenge, more patience required, more skill to advance, and then.....
These 'whiners' would have made more of an accomplishment than you ever made. You would forever be 'less' of a DF player than them. I hope you get your way. You are certainly on the right path. You 'whiner'.
How exactly does having more people to pvp with ruin your pvp experience again?
I'm missing something important. Can you really not have fun killing these guys? Does it really eat you up knowing it didn't take them as long to pvp as it took you?
I can't see this is anyone's problem except your own disfunctional psyche.
- or -
Is it that you think DF is suppose to be unfair. And the devs have made it fair. And you are complaining because the way devs are treating you isn't fair?
Hmmm.....i'm still left with the disfunctional psyche conclusion.
i am afraid it will never be "fair" and because you and others will never understand that the next wave of crying will come for sure..
Ah, I see your point. It will never be fair to you because they insist on making the game fair. The only fair way to treat you is to give you an unfair advantage. I can see how hurt you must be. "It is unfair to me that I don't have an unfair advantage". Great argument. You got me.
Although your response only tangently had something to do with mine, I'll show you how reading comprehension works:
1. Gamers you 'label' whiners complained about being treated unfairly, i.e. the First Wave of Crying
2. Developers made a change to get them closer to a competitive battlefield.
3. So you complained about being treated unfairly, i.e. the NEXT wave of crying
Logically, this means it is not I, who started 'the next wave of crying', it is you.
I have no complaints about DF, as I don't play it. I'm trying to make logical sense of your argument but you haven't presented a cogent argument and seem to not understand how illogical your argument sounds. But thanks for blaming its problems on someone who never has and never will play it.
My conclusions are out of logic:
A. You levelled before there was a large highly skilled population to trounce you as you skilled up.
B. Players now have a large highly skilled population trouncing new players as they skill up.
C. Ergo, your experience in skilling up did not have the major barrier that these 'whiners' did.
D. Ergo, you don't have a right to speak about what these players are dealing with, as you never had to deal with it in the quantities they have.
Hey, but if you get your way, and things stay the same, you can rest assured that each new player would skill up through an atmosphere you never had to deal with. More challenge, more patience required, more skill to advance, and then.....
These 'whiners' would have made more of an accomplishment than you ever made. You would forever be 'less' of a DF player than them. I hope you get your way. You are certainly on the right path. You 'whiner'.
About not logical argument i agree completly with you but to these A,B,C and D points i have to give you some informations about Darth.
A)He started about at the time of the expansion. So he didnt have all these advantages the vets had (no vets chars ganking people).
B)He has been aswell trounced except he was in zerg alliance called "Power Rangers" some time ago (more carebear style = safer to play).
C)/ D) He could actually speak about it.
Here come new details about him. He is grind lover. He can grind (farm resources) while working, so he was farming iron / stone a lot and so he became viable pretty fast and as he was in the zerg alliance he had aswell pretty safe playing, as they had barely enemys except Cairn against whom they sucked balls till the alliance splitted.
How exactly does having more people to pvp with ruin your pvp experience again?
I'm missing something important. Can you really not have fun killing these guys? Does it really eat you up knowing it didn't take them as long to pvp as it took you?
I can't see this is anyone's problem except your own disfunctional psyche.
- or -
Is it that you think DF is suppose to be unfair. And the devs have made it fair. And you are complaining because the way devs are treating you isn't fair?
Hmmm.....i'm still left with the disfunctional psyche conclusion.
i am afraid it will never be "fair" and because you and others will never understand that the next wave of crying will come for sure..
Ah, I see your point. It will never be fair to you because they insist on making the game fair. The only fair way to treat you is to give you an unfair advantage. I can see how hurt you must be. "It is unfair to me that I don't have an unfair advantage". Great argument. You got me.
Although your response only tangently had something to do with mine, I'll show you how reading comprehension works:
1. Gamers you 'label' whiners complained about being treated unfairly, i.e. the First Wave of Crying
2. Developers made a change to get them closer to a competitive battlefield.
3. So you complained about being treated unfairly, i.e. the NEXT wave of crying
Logically, this means it is not I, who started 'the next wave of crying', it is you.
I have no complaints about DF, as I don't play it. I'm trying to make logical sense of your argument but you haven't presented a cogent argument and seem to not understand how illogical your argument sounds. But thanks for blaming its problems on someone who never has and never will play it.
My conclusions are out of logic:
A. You levelled before there was a large highly skilled population to trounce you as you skilled up.
B. Players now have a large highly skilled population trouncing new players as they skill up.
C. Ergo, your experience in skilling up did not have the major barrier that these 'whiners' did.
D. Ergo, you don't have a right to speak about what these players are dealing with, as you never had to deal with it in the quantities they have.
Hey, but if you get your way, and things stay the same, you can rest assured that each new player would skill up through an atmosphere you never had to deal with. More challenge, more patience required, more skill to advance, and then.....
These 'whiners' would have made more of an accomplishment than you ever made. You would forever be 'less' of a DF player than them. I hope you get your way. You are certainly on the right path. You 'whiner'.
About not logical argument i agree completly with you but to these A,B,C and D points i have to give you some informations about Darth.
A)He started about at the time of the expansion. So he didnt have all these advantages the vets had (no vets chars ganking people).
B)He has been aswell trounced except he was in zerg alliance called "Power Rangers" some time ago (more carebear style = safer to play).
C)/ D) He could actually speak about it.
Here come new details about him. He is grind lover. He can grind (farm resources) while working, so he was farming iron / stone a lot and so he became viable pretty fast and as he was in the zerg alliance he had aswell pretty safe playing, as they had barely enemys except Cairn against whom they sucked balls till the alliance splitted.
You both are so wrong that i need to laugh.
Not only about your fail profiling of me Xianthos (i will let that at this for the moment) but also about the fail "logical" explanation of Zorgo's post.
Good that you state you didn't played the game Zorgo, this gives you a good excuse for the "logic" in your claims.
May i ask you a question and for a "logical" answer i would be thankfull..
The first months after the launch, all even playing field, what you call those crybabies who begged for ez-mode skill up ? That was the first whiner wave.
Also did you add in your "logical" calculation that after the crybaies got their toys, that is faster skill gains up to 6x, did it was fair then to them ? or to those who did to go through months without the EZ-mode ? Did they stop crying ? No..their insta ..give me..beggar ..mindset turned them against the stat gain this time.
-----MY-TERMS-OF-USE-------------------------------------------------- $OE - eternal enemy of online gaming -We finally WON !!!! 2011 $OE accepted that they have been fired 2005 by the playerbase and closed down ridiculous NGE !!
"There was suppression of speech and all kinds of things between disturbing and fascistic." Raph Koster (parted $OE)
I think this is more about making money. A lot o people won't try the game because they hear "Oh, it takes about 1-2 months, then you can PvP". They want money. Let them have their money.
How exactly does having more people to pvp with ruin your pvp experience again?
I'm missing something important. Can you really not have fun killing these guys? Does it really eat you up knowing it didn't take them as long to pvp as it took you?
I can't see this is anyone's problem except your own disfunctional psyche.
- or -
Is it that you think DF is suppose to be unfair. And the devs have made it fair. And you are complaining because the way devs are treating you isn't fair?
Hmmm.....i'm still left with the disfunctional psyche conclusion.
i am afraid it will never be "fair" and because you and others will never understand that the next wave of crying will come for sure..
Ah, I see your point. It will never be fair to you because they insist on making the game fair. The only fair way to treat you is to give you an unfair advantage. I can see how hurt you must be. "It is unfair to me that I don't have an unfair advantage". Great argument. You got me.
Although your response only tangently had something to do with mine, I'll show you how reading comprehension works:
1. Gamers you 'label' whiners complained about being treated unfairly, i.e. the First Wave of Crying
2. Developers made a change to get them closer to a competitive battlefield.
3. So you complained about being treated unfairly, i.e. the NEXT wave of crying
Logically, this means it is not I, who started 'the next wave of crying', it is you.
I have no complaints about DF, as I don't play it. I'm trying to make logical sense of your argument but you haven't presented a cogent argument and seem to not understand how illogical your argument sounds. But thanks for blaming its problems on someone who never has and never will play it.
My conclusions are out of logic:
A. You levelled before there was a large highly skilled population to trounce you as you skilled up.
B. Players now have a large highly skilled population trouncing new players as they skill up.
C. Ergo, your experience in skilling up did not have the major barrier that these 'whiners' did.
D. Ergo, you don't have a right to speak about what these players are dealing with, as you never had to deal with it in the quantities they have.
Hey, but if you get your way, and things stay the same, you can rest assured that each new player would skill up through an atmosphere you never had to deal with. More challenge, more patience required, more skill to advance, and then.....
These 'whiners' would have made more of an accomplishment than you ever made. You would forever be 'less' of a DF player than them. I hope you get your way. You are certainly on the right path. You 'whiner'.
Hats down to you mate. I wouldn't bother with DarthRaiden though, he lives in his own buble where he is the Queen of the world and his word is law, anything else is dogs barking. Do not try to reason with him, do not waste your typing on him, you will not receive an intelligent conversation. To your logic (as you can see in his post below), he presents ... nothing. He only says you are wrong and according to her majesty, it is enough to void all your logical arguments.
Hats down to you mate. I wouldn't bother with DarthRaiden though, he lives in his own buble where he is the Queen of the world and his word is law, anything else is dogs barking. Do not try to reason with him, do not waste your typing on him, you will not receive an intelligent conversation. To your logic (as you can see in his post below), he presents ... nothing. He only says you are wrong and according to her majesty, it is enough to void all your logical arguments.
I dont know but kinda DarthRaiden reminds me extremly of Xpiher. At least the same way of thinking like "Im right and it doesnt matter what you are going to say, as you will be always wrong wrong and wrong"
Hats down to you mate. I wouldn't bother with DarthRaiden though, he lives in his own buble where he is the Queen of the world and his word is law, anything else is dogs barking. Do not try to reason with him, do not waste your typing on him, you will not receive an intelligent conversation. To your logic (as you can see in his post below), he presents ... nothing. He only says you are wrong and according to her majesty, it is enough to void all your logical arguments.
But referring to DarthRaiden as being female is some sort of intelligent conversation, right.
"Mr. Rothstein, your people never will understand... the way it works out here. You're all just our guests. But you act like you're at home. Let me tell you something, partner. You ain't home. But that's where we're gonna send you if it harelips the governor." - Pat Webb
"We are significantly changing the progression of hitpoints in a diminishing returns fashion. This is done to improve a character’s viability in PvP situations and to make players of all levels more competitive." -Tasos
Once again the hardcore dedicated players get the shaft as their months spent training up their hit points can be made up for in "significantly" reduced time byt he whiners who weren't willing to put forth the effort.
Character progression was part of the compitition in DF and since they just keep making things easier for the whiners, this competitive gamer is going to start looking for another game, one that doesn't cater to whiners who incessently post about how the game needs to be made easier to attract customers.
I thought lessons would have been learned from the last game that was ruined by increasing character progression rate, SWG, but it seems AV is doomed to repeat the same mistake.
more end game content is going to not going keep me playing DF when they contiually give the less intelligent vocal whiners an easy ride so they can "catch up" with what some of us have spent months to achieve.
I'm finally getting near HP cap after over a year of play and now AV is allowing everyone to get there in a significantly reduced amount of time. Doesn't make me very happy, in fact it makes me not give a shit about the game anymore and makes me contemplate getting hacks to make up for all the work that will have been wasted developing my character.
Why would I, as a competitive gamer, continue to play a game that is continually made easier due to the developers catering to those who aren't willing to put forth the same amount of effort as everyone else?
some play DF because they like the idea of character development being part of the compitition, when that is gone, so will those players will start to be.
this isn't about having an advanced character to win with, this is about those advanced characters getting killed simply b/c they are vs more than one opponent. Darkfall is rarely about 1v1 and competitive gamers need to be able to 2v1 and 3v1 the noobs to keep them playing. Not like in WoW and other pvp mmorpgs where you don't stand a chance outnumbered nomatter how much skill you have, that is why I quit WoW.
You absolute ass !!!
Darkfall was NEVER about your avatars skill, it all about the player skill. WOW is all about your avatars skill not the players skill.
This and hopefully others makes Darkfall more like it should always have been.
Skill gain in game was never meant to be the massive game changer it is now.
Face it you have played the game for a year and you are burnt out. A small thing like this comes along and you quit because you are bored. Either that or you should have been playing WOW all along so that you as a player can hide behind the dice rolls and your level 60 stats.
Roll on more changes Darkfall !!! Make it the game it always should have been. Oh and bring in racial wars please ARAC ruin the game.
Comments
When in fact many players have been requesting for months to reduce the grind to increase PvP in a PVP GAME. Reducing Grind does NOT ruin gameplay, it enhances it by sending more "PvP-ready" players out in the field so that everyone can actually enjoy good PvP across Agon.
And most players have been asking for more incentive to PvP....in a PvP game....go figure....
Good post. Players like darth raiden know that. They only want to whine about the upcoming change because they dont want to get stomp pwned by 1-3 months old players. They know that they wont be able to win 1 vs 3 soon, so they start fearing us newb's that will be viable pretty quick and populate DF with over 5k active players in one server. He fear that the world of DF politic will become Anarchy.
C:\Users\FF\Desktop\spin move.gif
Real and Madness, what you need to understand is that my expectation if i join a MMORPG is to find people at various stage of progression, some will have lower skills other will have higher skills and prob few will have max skills and others will differs in skills. Thats MMORPG core, and no it isnt i want defend my "uber skills" cause i played no macro and casual over the last year. Myself i am happy to have goals and i would not mind if i needed years to get to my "completed char" (if something like that exist in an MMORPG at all).
What you and others suggest will put many chars in a fraction of time at some "max stage of development" .No i don't mean the hp change coming this expac, i mean the mindset behind all this demands for changes . I know this mindset from previous MMO's , people intrested in max char was just duelling the whole day as soon as they reached what they thought is a "completed PvP char" and you could forget them in regards to "playing" the game and participating in clan activities if it wasn't sieges and clan fights. I just forsee if the changes go down the road the mainstream demands we have prob a lot more player hanging around in player cities and logging in for sieges and stuff, because they will have their "pvp ready char" and the status on map will be about the same.
Btw what is these "PvP ready" talk. It is a "worldy" world and not some arena.Some fights with people you will meet in the field you will will win some fights you will loose. Most fights will never account you as a single fighter cause you will face groups of various people and sizes and even if you have good skills you loose. A "worldy" world is not fair and you will loose a lot of times. There is no balance in it and there shouldn't be one.
-----MY-TERMS-OF-USE--------------------------------------------------
$OE - eternal enemy of online gaming
-We finally WON !!!! 2011 $OE accepted that they have been fired 2005 by the playerbase and closed down ridiculous NGE !!
"There was suppression of speech and all kinds of things between disturbing and fascistic." Raph Koster (parted $OE)
What you need to understand is that grinding is not the only form of Character Progression, especially in Sandbox Games, this is not currently the case in DarkFall, the only way to progress is to grind.
To use Trashburnin's expression where he claims that players asking for a reduced grind simply because they were" poisoned" by the WoW mentality, it's actually the opposite around. Both you and him see grinding as the only way to Progress in a Sandbox MMORPG. Then again, it's understandable considering the lack of lore or anything else in DarkFall at the moment, but it is still possible to progress in the game through your actions, create your own story, etc. It's a sandbox FFA PvP MMO dammit, not a WoW-let's-grind-to-80-as-soon-as-possible-so-we-can-join-the-end-game.
DarthRaiden?
How exactly does having more people to pvp with ruin your pvp experience again?
I'm missing something important. Can you really not have fun killing these guys? Does it really eat you up knowing it didn't take them as long to pvp as it took you?
I can't see this is anyone's problem except your own disfunctional psyche.
- or -
Is it that you think DF is suppose to be unfair. And the devs have made it fair. And you are complaining because the way devs are treating you isn't fair?
Hmmm.....i'm still left with the disfunctional psyche conclusion.
i am afraid it will never be "fair" and because you and others will never understand that the next wave of crying will come for sure..
-----MY-TERMS-OF-USE--------------------------------------------------
$OE - eternal enemy of online gaming
-We finally WON !!!! 2011 $OE accepted that they have been fired 2005 by the playerbase and closed down ridiculous NGE !!
"There was suppression of speech and all kinds of things between disturbing and fascistic." Raph Koster (parted $OE)
No one is asking for it to be 100% fair. But so that at least when you win a 1vs5 fight (you being the loner), you can say that it's because you were really skilled. Not because you spammed 5 AoE Magic and everyone's dead. The sole purpose of reducing the grind is to shorten the gap between Vets and New players, not to the extent where a new player can destroy a vet in a single day, but at least make it so that instead of taking 6 months to be able to hold your grounds in a 1vs1 situation, it should take 2 months. It's a reasonable timeline for a PVP GAME.
I mean seriously, I've seen a single player raid Hammerdale and just kill everyone without actually trying....how fun is that? 1vs20 and he still wons, not because the new players sucks, but because there's no way for them to fight back! "Just stand there and make it short so we can move on and go back to grinding"....where's the fun in that?
Darth, you playing a PvP game. In PvP, there is no real long term character progression. Long term character progression exists mostly (around 95%) on PvE side.
I am the type of player where I like to do everything and anything from time to time.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holodomor - pre-WW2 genocide.
Darkfall is a pvp game. I don't want to spend half a year to BEGIN being competitive. I can play Call of Duty and be competitive at day 1. But someone who played a year in CoD will have a small advantage, perks, map knowledge, ect.
Sounds to me like real pvp'ers would WELCOME this change. You get more compitition. I don't hear whining from the OP, I hear fear. You spent all this time making sure you had a significant advantage over most players. What you are saying is that you are scared to fight on a level field, and rely on your own skill to make you better.
I tried Darkfall. Saw how fun the pvp and sieges could be, then disputed the credit card transaction and unsubbed after my first 30 days. Why? I didn't want to spend months of time watching OTHER people have fun while I worked. If I wanted to do that I'd get a job at Disney World sweeping floors. It takes maybe 2 months to become competitive at WoW. During that time you do some fun quests, dungeons, ect. In darkfall you afk macro and spam the same skills over, and over, then over again, and a few more times after that, only for 12 months.
The issue I feel is that for over a year the True Darkfall fans have been forced to do this Mindless grind. They have put hours and hours of hardcore gamer Sweat and BLood into this game. If they make changes to reduce all of that, its like a kick in the balls to all those gamers who deserve what they earned.
This is a MMORPG, not a first person shooter CoD. I am all for bridging the gap for all your FPS players but if they reduced the grind too much I would probably hate the game for making me spend all that money for something that could have cost half the price to get. I think the darkfall devs know this and will do the right thing. They said they are only making minor changes to bridge the gap in the Hitpoints area.
Thats it.
Website | Forum | Values | Join Us!
Erm, are you suppose to be the defender of the grind with statements like that?
So you agree the game is a mindless grind, and we have to put hours upon hours of sweat and blood to play this game. And the tiny population that manage to survive the months of macroing and grinding deserve what we have earned? You have to be a troll to say they have to keep it like this and never get another new player to the game.
Ohh, and what have we earned, what work? I play civ 4 and Darkfall on two accounts at the moment. I think when I play civ4, Darkfall plays itself. I sometimes glance at the other monitor to see if I get a GM call, that`s all. So you grinders really think time and nothing but time should be the factor in this pvp mmo? Jesus, no wonder the population is low.
And we know this isn`t a first person shooter, you can stop telling us this. FPS games have 50 million players, we have 5 k.
I didn't hear much QQ when they increase the Skill Gain by 6x on Monsters for Magic (3x on players) and 3x on Monsters and Players for Melee/Archery. Beside, it's common knowledge that a large portion of the vets macro'ed their way up and far too many people do macro their way up these days too.
Unless you want to keep playing Fantasy-style EVE with Offline Skill Progression, I really don't see why people would complain about reducing the grind. As I said, you're basically increasing the amount of PvP and at the same time bringing more challenges for Vets, who won't be as bored as they currently are.
Making things more challenging for Vets?
But what would the wolves do without sheep to slaughter? They'd starve!
They're already starving because they ate most of the sheeps. Reducing the grind, making the game more PvP-focused and a lot more fun means that more "sheeps" will join. This is one of the major issue that new players have with DarkFall, the need to grind for 6 month before actually being able to PvP when they joined DarkFall as it was advertised as a FFA PvP MMO, when in fact, it's more of a PvE game with PvP End-Game.
Reducing the grind means that DarkFall will bring a lot more players to Agon, effectively bringing both more sheeps for wolves to feeds on and more PvP for players looking for actions. It's what Aventurine needs to do to bring more subs,make the game a lot more interesting, and closer to what we were promised when we purchased DarkFall: A FFA PvP MMO. Not some PvE MMO with end-game PvP, there's plenty of those on the market already.
Beside, the PvE isn't all that hard. Heck, ever fought the Devil? Just spawn some Battlehorns in front of him and spam his ass with archery or Magic.....god that's hard.
Yay some valid points
The wolves were starving already when i played DF and it was some months ago. Thats why i hear by my old guilds mates that more often aswell vets leave DF out of boredom.
My main concern is that i dont see how AV want to get turn around for DF. I simply dont see how they want to manage it if they go on like before. Yeah they got spotlight forum now, but the info there is more "vague" then accurate and people arent smarter after reading them.
I think DF will exist till another game with full loot FFA PVP comes by and makes it better. Right now they got more or less a monopol on this niche, which kinda sux.
EvE doors
See the best doors on EvE-on!
A 5k players monopoly ain't that great (Number ain't 100% accurate) when compared to the 200k players who wanted to buy the pre-order back in Feb of 2009 :P
Ah, I see your point. It will never be fair to you because they insist on making the game fair. The only fair way to treat you is to give you an unfair advantage. I can see how hurt you must be. "It is unfair to me that I don't have an unfair advantage". Great argument. You got me.
Although your response only tangently had something to do with mine, I'll show you how reading comprehension works:
1. Gamers you 'label' whiners complained about being treated unfairly, i.e. the First Wave of Crying
2. Developers made a change to get them closer to a competitive battlefield.
3. So you complained about being treated unfairly, i.e. the NEXT wave of crying
Logically, this means it is not I, who started 'the next wave of crying', it is you.
I have no complaints about DF, as I don't play it. I'm trying to make logical sense of your argument but you haven't presented a cogent argument and seem to not understand how illogical your argument sounds. But thanks for blaming its problems on someone who never has and never will play it.
My conclusions are out of logic:
A. You levelled before there was a large highly skilled population to trounce you as you skilled up.
B. Players now have a large highly skilled population trouncing new players as they skill up.
C. Ergo, your experience in skilling up did not have the major barrier that these 'whiners' did.
D. Ergo, you don't have a right to speak about what these players are dealing with, as you never had to deal with it in the quantities they have.
Hey, but if you get your way, and things stay the same, you can rest assured that each new player would skill up through an atmosphere you never had to deal with. More challenge, more patience required, more skill to advance, and then.....
These 'whiners' would have made more of an accomplishment than you ever made. You would forever be 'less' of a DF player than them. I hope you get your way. You are certainly on the right path. You 'whiner'.
EvE doors
See the best doors on EvE-on!
You both are so wrong that i need to laugh.
Not only about your fail profiling of me Xianthos (i will let that at this for the moment) but also about the fail "logical" explanation of Zorgo's post.
Good that you state you didn't played the game Zorgo, this gives you a good excuse for the "logic" in your claims.
May i ask you a question and for a "logical" answer i would be thankfull..
The first months after the launch, all even playing field, what you call those crybabies who begged for ez-mode skill up ? That was the first whiner wave.
Also did you add in your "logical" calculation that after the crybaies got their toys, that is faster skill gains up to 6x, did it was fair then to them ? or to those who did to go through months without the EZ-mode ? Did they stop crying ? No..their insta ..give me..beggar ..mindset turned them against the stat gain this time.
-----MY-TERMS-OF-USE--------------------------------------------------
$OE - eternal enemy of online gaming
-We finally WON !!!! 2011 $OE accepted that they have been fired 2005 by the playerbase and closed down ridiculous NGE !!
"There was suppression of speech and all kinds of things between disturbing and fascistic." Raph Koster (parted $OE)
I think this is more about making money. A lot o people won't try the game because they hear "Oh, it takes about 1-2 months, then you can PvP". They want money. Let them have their money.
Its ok, you can still AFK grind against a wall...
Hats down to you mate. I wouldn't bother with DarthRaiden though, he lives in his own buble where he is the Queen of the world and his word is law, anything else is dogs barking. Do not try to reason with him, do not waste your typing on him, you will not receive an intelligent conversation. To your logic (as you can see in his post below), he presents ... nothing. He only says you are wrong and according to her majesty, it is enough to void all your logical arguments.
I am the type of player where I like to do everything and anything from time to time.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holodomor - pre-WW2 genocide.
I dont know but kinda DarthRaiden reminds me extremly of Xpiher. At least the same way of thinking like "Im right and it doesnt matter what you are going to say, as you will be always wrong wrong and wrong"
EvE doors
See the best doors on EvE-on!
But referring to DarthRaiden as being female is some sort of intelligent conversation, right.
"Mr. Rothstein, your people never will understand... the way it works out here. You're all just our guests. But you act like you're at home. Let me tell you something, partner. You ain't home. But that's where we're gonna send you if it harelips the governor." - Pat Webb
You absolute ass !!!
Darkfall was NEVER about your avatars skill, it all about the player skill. WOW is all about your avatars skill not the players skill.
This and hopefully others makes Darkfall more like it should always have been.
Skill gain in game was never meant to be the massive game changer it is now.
Face it you have played the game for a year and you are burnt out. A small thing like this comes along and you quit because you are bored. Either that or you should have been playing WOW all along so that you as a player can hide behind the dice rolls and your level 60 stats.
Roll on more changes Darkfall !!! Make it the game it always should have been. Oh and bring in racial wars please ARAC ruin the game.