I want to be ambushed by 2 guys and win the game due to MY skills, not my character skills.
Then you are playing the wrong game.
Because character progression is at the core of RPG games (DF is an mmoRPG). If you want to remove the character progression , FPS games is what you are looking for.
You are not forced to do any of that. You make your own choices. You think you are forced to do it because you think "better education=better future". Its true to a point, but not a fact. Even the law, you arent forced to obey it - but you will suffer the consequences. DF is more anarchic then real life because the consequences are.. practically non existant. What consequences you get for farming noobs? You get better standings so you can gank more of your own people. Maybe you get ganked by some guy who protects noobs and lose your gear - thats not as bad as a noob losing their gear. There are practically no consequences for being mean in DF. I'm not talking about hacking, just using standard DF mechanics for bad behaviour - noob killing, noob farming, kill stealing, corpse stealing, mount stealing, etc etc. Vets lose little, noobs lose a lot.
Noobs lose a lot? What the heck were you carrying around with you when you played, geez? Only carry/wear what you don't mind losing, it's not complicated.
In the beginning the only stuff I equipped and carried was the crap I was looting. Something tells me the way you went about things in this game wasn't exactly the wisest path. You really would have benefited from trying out different clans until you found one that fit. Then you could have been properly introduced to the game.
I grinded goblins because I needed that crappy gear to sell for little gold to a vendor to gain enough gold to buy my next skill. You clearly show the vet perspective - what can you lose? 500 gold max? To me, 500 gold = 2-3 hours of grinding goblins, unless someone vet comes in and takes it all away from me. IM A NOOB for christsake, i can't farm 1000000 gold with a single fart, yet.
Maybe It wasn't the wisest way to do things, but I couldn't learn the wise thing because someone poped in and stoped me from playing the game. I had to wait before he went away. I like to explore things, all kinds of things. Tap into archery, magic, melee, try different armors, weapons, fight different mobs, go to different locations. Im a noob, I don't know whats the most efficient way to earn money, I don't know where the best spawns are, I don't know which skills are a must and which aren't worth 100 gold, I don't know how to escape from a fight. And I never will because people gank me and I lose my stuff and any desire to continue playing because I have to do the whole grinding again.
You obviously have never been a noob or you have forgotten how it is to be a noob - curious by everything new, helpless because someone came in and stole your time, angry because no matter what you do - you cannot defeat the menace. Noobs are like little children, everytime you 4-5 shot them and they lose their stuff - you are taking away their candy.
I want to be ambushed by 2 guys and win the game due to MY skills, not my character skills.
Then you are playing the wrong game.
Because character progression is at the core of RPG games (DF is an mmoRPG). If you want to remove the character progression , FPS games is what you are looking for.
Not remove it, change it - it can be done and its been done.
I already play FPS games, I want to play MMORPG games with FFA PvP and full loot. If I wanted to play FPS id play Planetside. They have progression there even without PvE. Imagine what DF can have if they fix their PvP mechanics. hundreds of thousands of people!
You are not forced to do any of that. You make your own choices. You think you are forced to do it because you think "better education=better future". Its true to a point, but not a fact. Even the law, you arent forced to obey it - but you will suffer the consequences. DF is more anarchic then real life because the consequences are.. practically non existant. What consequences you get for farming noobs? You get better standings so you can gank more of your own people. Maybe you get ganked by some guy who protects noobs and lose your gear - thats not as bad as a noob losing their gear. There are practically no consequences for being mean in DF. I'm not talking about hacking, just using standard DF mechanics for bad behaviour - noob killing, noob farming, kill stealing, corpse stealing, mount stealing, etc etc. Vets lose little, noobs lose a lot.
Noobs lose a lot? What the heck were you carrying around with you when you played, geez? Only carry/wear what you don't mind losing, it's not complicated.
In the beginning the only stuff I equipped and carried was the crap I was looting. Something tells me the way you went about things in this game wasn't exactly the wisest path. You really would have benefited from trying out different clans until you found one that fit. Then you could have been properly introduced to the game.
I grinded goblins because I needed that crappy gear to sell for little gold to a vendor to gain enough gold to buy my next skill. You clearly show the vet perspective - what can you lose? 500 gold max? To me, 500 gold = 2-3 hours of grinding goblins, unless someone vet comes in and takes it all away from me. IM A NOOB for christsake, i can't farm 1000000 gold with a single fart, yet.
Maybe It wasn't the wisest way to do things, but I couldn't learn the wise thing because someone poped in and stoped me from playing the game. I had to wait before he went away. I like to explore things, all kinds of things. Tap into archery, magic, melee, try different armors, weapons, fight different mobs, go to different locations. Im a noob, I don't know whats the most efficient way to earn money, I don't know where the best spawns are, I don't know which skills are a must and which aren't worth 100 gold, I don't know how to escape from a fight. And I never will because people gank me and I lose my stuff and any desire to continue playing because I have to do the whole grinding again.
You obviously have never been a noob or you have forgotten how it is to be a noob - curious by everything new, helpless because someone came in and stole your time, angry because no matter what you do - you cannot defeat the menace. Noobs are like little children, everytime you 4-5 shot them and they lose their stuff - you are taking away their candy.
Why are you starting with the noob martyr complex? We all were noobs in-game at some point. My noob experience was different from yours. And others have posted their's was too. So stop making it out to be a noob vs vet perspective argument. It isn't.
As a noob, I adjusted and was fine. I can count on two hands how many times I was ganked in 6 months. What you're wanting is for the game to adjust to you instead of you adjusting to the game.
Current: None Played: WoW, CoX, SWG, LotRO, EVE, AoC, VG, CO, Ryzom, DF, WAR Tried: Lineage2, Dofus, EQ2, CoS, FE, UO, Wurm, Wakfu Future: The Repopulation, ArcheAge, Black Desert, EQN
I played for 2 months with my clan in this game, in the end it wasn't the pvp that was the issue, it was the blatent hacks, non-finished game that was the issue. If there are people here attempting to recruit people into this game that alone says enough about the game. If you can't hold a descent population in your title, ummm there probably is something wrong with your title to begain with.
Pretty much sums that up nicly, let the flames continue!
"The monster created isn't by the company that makes the game, it's by the fans that make it something it never was"
1) Thats the problem with DF, not getting fair fights. It CAN be done to BE full loot FFA PvP with either one of these:
- tiered PvP;
- safe zones;
- severe penalties to unfair combat;
I don't want to play FPS, I already have one that I play. I wan't to play FFA PvP MMORPG. DF is the closest thing to that at the moment.
2) Again, I explained several million times that in a system that DF has now, leveling up at times can be IMPOSSIBLE if you keep getting farmed and lose your items. Your leveling up depends not on you, but on someone else who wants to farm easy prey. I don't think you like the idea of someone walking into your room, turning off your monitor and telling you "You had enough for today, go clean up your closet".
3) You can, but it is highly unlikely that someone will listen. The main reason for this is - why change something that is highly sucessfull? You only change something that does not work well. DF does not work well. And you can keep telling me that "does not work well" is how it was designed, I will never agree with you. DF was not designed to work that way. Change of skill gain and health boost are just 2 examples of fixing something that was not working well. More to come I hope.
1. It's a sandbox, tiered pvp and zones are not the remit of a sandbox game. Perhaps you should try WAR or AoC.
2. No it isn't. If you keep getting farmed then I am sorry but you are doing it wrong. Try moving somewhere that isn't a major hub which will attract PKers, try looking around and using the terrain. In my first two months of play I got killed a whopping 5 times whilst skilling up. More people actually came up to me and gave me gold/items then killed me and took them from me.
3. They are successful because the majority do not want ffa pvp, most players are casuals. Are you trying to imply that all games should strive to follow that model in the hopes of chasing millions of subs? Oddly enough some of us actually like full loot ffa progression games and DF caters for us. DF IS working as AV intended it to in terms of its pvp mechanics, what they have though done is balls up in not having a skill cap and the length of the grind.
Should DF ever become more carebear and tone down it's ffa pvp system then no doubt another developer will at some point make another niche mmo to cater to those of us who like the kind of pvp mechanics DF has now. I take it you will jump onto forums regarding that mmo as well hoping to get it 'toned down' to match all the other pvp lite mmos out there on the market place.
1) sandbox and tiered PvP or restricted PvP are not self exclusive. I tried WAR and AOC and I found WAR to be too much like WoW, while AOC had uninteresting combat style and too linear (very little sandbox).
I guess we have a difference in the definition of sandbox - to me, the more choices I have - the more sandbox it is. One of the definitions of sandbox: "An open world is a type of video game level design concept where a player can freely roam a virtual world". When one player has a freedom to suppress freedom of the other player, that is NOT sandbox. It seems that you think otherwise.
2) I am glad you had a great experience while going through the "hell" levels. usually, "hell" levels are at a higher end of the gameplay, not at the beginning. Shortly speaking (too tired to write the same thing over and oaver, did you even read any of my posts?): if one player forces you to stop enjoying gameplay the way you want it without your consent, that is sandbox for the griefer, but not a sandbox for the victim, that is not Open PvP, that is Anarchy.
3) if DF is working as intended, then why was there a skill gain increase? Why was there health increase? No, DF was not working as they wanted it, and they saw it. They gave it a little change, look at the reception level and do more balancing if necessary. Every game keeps balancing up and down. DF kept balancing things down all the time. Doesn't that tell you they are far from the balance level that will satisfy them? With each patch they make things better and better for people like I. Eventually, they will make it good enough for me to try it again. At that time we will trully have a PvP game, not a griefing game.
Why are you starting with the noob martyr complex? We all were noobs in-game at some point. My noob experience was different from yours. And others have posted their's was too. So stop making it out to be a noob vs vet perspective argument. It isn't.
As a noob, I adjusted and was fine. I can count on two hands how many times I was ganked in 6 months. What you're wanting is for the game to adjust to you instead of you adjusting to the game.
I played for 2 months with my clan in this game, in the end it wasn't the pvp that was the issue, it was the blatent hacks, non-finished game that was the issue. If there are people here attempting to recruit people into this game that alone says enough about the game. If you can't hold a descent population in your title, ummm there probably is something wrong with your title to begain with.
Pretty much sums that up nicly, let the flames continue!
You may want to try the game again. Hacks are dealt with for the most part. The game is much more stable as it was before. There is a trial.
Why are you starting with the noob martyr complex? We all were noobs in-game at some point. My noob experience was different from yours. And others have posted their's was too. So stop making it out to be a noob vs vet perspective argument. It isn't.
As a noob, I adjusted and was fine. I can count on two hands how many times I was ganked in 6 months. What you're wanting is for the game to adjust to you instead of you adjusting to the game.
When did you start playing?
November, last year.
Current: None Played: WoW, CoX, SWG, LotRO, EVE, AoC, VG, CO, Ryzom, DF, WAR Tried: Lineage2, Dofus, EQ2, CoS, FE, UO, Wurm, Wakfu Future: The Repopulation, ArcheAge, Black Desert, EQN
I played for 2 months with my clan in this game, in the end it wasn't the pvp that was the issue, it was the blatent hacks, non-finished game that was the issue. If there are people here attempting to recruit people into this game that alone says enough about the game. If you can't hold a descent population in your title, ummm there probably is something wrong with your title to begain with.
Pretty much sums that up nicly, let the flames continue!
You may want to try the game again. Hacks are dealt with for the most part. The game is much more stable as it was before. There is a trial.
well coming from you that actually means something, IE you have been around here as long as I have , I might just do that indeed. Still got my account. Thnx, thou if the population is still hurting that doesn't say much for it's longevity, eh I will try it again thou as I liked it for what it is, thou the issues for-mentioned ruined it, hmm... wonder how the old clan is still doing?
"The monster created isn't by the company that makes the game, it's by the fans that make it something it never was"
Noobs lose a lot? What the heck were you carrying around with you when you played, geez? Only carry/wear what you don't mind losing, it's not complicated.
In the beginning the only stuff I equipped and carried was the crap I was looting. Something tells me the way you went about things in this game wasn't exactly the wisest path. You really would have benefited from trying out different clans until you found one that fit. Then you could have been properly introduced to the game.
I grinded goblins because I needed that crappy gear to sell for little gold to a vendor to gain enough gold to buy my next skill. You clearly show the vet perspective - what can you lose? 500 gold max? To me, 500 gold = 2-3 hours of grinding goblins, unless someone vet comes in and takes it all away from me. IM A NOOB for christsake, i can't farm 1000000 gold with a single fart, yet. You needed to seriously move to a new location. During my first 2 months I must have moved like 6 or 7 times. Also, you have to be logical and scout out the area surrounding a spawn before engaging it.
Maybe It wasn't the wisest way to do things, but I couldn't learn the wise thing because someone poped in and stoped me from playing the game. I had to wait before he went away. I like to explore things, all kinds of things. Tap into archery, magic, melee, try different armors, weapons, fight different mobs, go to different locations. Im a noob, I don't know whats the most efficient way to earn money, I don't know where the best spawns are, I don't know which skills are a must and which aren't worth 100 gold, I don't know how to escape from a fight. And I never will because people gank me and I lose my stuff and any desire to continue playing because I have to do the whole grinding again. You should have been studying this map. It did wonders for my experience in the game. It even tells you the location of each spawn and what difficulty they are, and where all of the cities hamlets villages are etc. It's not a difficult task to find a "quiet" mob at any level.
You obviously have never been a noob or you have forgotten how it is to be a noob - curious by everything new, helpless because someone came in and stole your time, angry because no matter what you do - you cannot defeat the menace. Noobs are like little children, everytime you 4-5 shot them and they lose their stuff - you are taking away their candy. I magically entered the game as a vet lol, ya right. No, I don't forget what it was like, but I think you needed a bit help of with respect to getting a good start in Darkfall. That goes for most people. You could have even avoided joining a clan by talking to different people at the NPC cities (not the starter ones). Not only were people helping me out (a lot of the time they would approach me), people were giving me mounts, weapons/armour, and ready bags in addition to all of the tips.
Sounds like you had a terrible first experience that many of us just never had to go through.
"Mr. Rothstein, your people never will understand... the way it works out here. You're all just our guests. But you act like you're at home. Let me tell you something, partner. You ain't home. But that's where we're gonna send you if it harelips the governor." - Pat Webb
well coming from you that actually means something, IE you have been around here as long as I have , I might just do that indeed. Still got my account. Thnx, thou if the population is still hurting that doesn't say much for it's longevity, eh I will try it again thou as I liked it for what it is, thou the issues for-mentioned ruined it, hmm... wonder how the old clan is still doing?
Population is bustling at the moment. Great time to plunge back into Agon.
"Mr. Rothstein, your people never will understand... the way it works out here. You're all just our guests. But you act like you're at home. Let me tell you something, partner. You ain't home. But that's where we're gonna send you if it harelips the governor." - Pat Webb
I want to be ambushed by 2 guys and win the game due to MY skills, not my character skills.
Then you are playing the wrong game.
Because character progression is at the core of RPG games (DF is an mmoRPG). If you want to remove the character progression , FPS games is what you are looking for.
Not remove it, change it - it can be done and its been done.
I already play FPS games, I want to play MMORPG games with FFA PvP and full loot. If I wanted to play FPS id play Planetside. They have progression there even without PvE. Imagine what DF can have if they fix their PvP mechanics. hundreds of thousands of people!
Ok, but what you are proposing is not the solution.
You are complaining because other players are stronger than you because of character progression, and you want to win thanks to your own skills.
With this you are only adding a greater injustice to the game. Because some players, even if they play 24/24 will always be less skilled than the others. They will never have a chance to catch up.
At least with DF everyone one has a chance to compete (even if less skilled or disabled IRL). Everyone can work on their character. Of course it's not perfect, but neither is a game based on player skill. DF is both.
1) sandbox and tiered PvP or restricted PvP are not self exclusive. I tried WAR and AOC and I found WAR to be too much like WoW, while AOC had uninteresting combat style and too linear (very little sandbox).
I guess we have a difference in the definition of sandbox - to me, the more choices I have - the more sandbox it is. One of the definitions of sandbox: "An open world is a type of video game level design concept where a player can freely roam a virtual world". When one player has a freedom to suppress freedom of the other player, that is NOT sandbox. It seems that you think otherwise.
2) I am glad you had a great experience while going through the "hell" levels. usually, "hell" levels are at a higher end of the gameplay, not at the beginning. Shortly speaking (too tired to write the same thing over and oaver, did you even read any of my posts?): if one player forces you to stop enjoying gameplay the way you want it without your consent, that is sandbox for the griefer, but not a sandbox for the victim, that is not Open PvP, that is Anarchy.
3) if DF is working as intended, then why was there a skill gain increase? Why was there health increase? No, DF was not working as they wanted it, and they saw it. They gave it a little change, look at the reception level and do more balancing if necessary. Every game keeps balancing up and down. DF kept balancing things down all the time. Doesn't that tell you they are far from the balance level that will satisfy them? With each patch they make things better and better for people like I. Eventually, they will make it good enough for me to try it again. At that time we will trully have a PvP game, not a griefing game.
1. Sandbox with FFA pvp means pvp everywhere for everyone at any time. You can roam about the world in DF, the point though is so can everyone else. No one is 'supressing' you in DF, you are just unlucky enough on occassion to run into people who will kill you, quite why that would be a suprise in an ffa pvp game I don't know.
2. Most people who actually stick with the game realise they are not 'hell levels' and that over the course of your characters development you are not actually killed that often. The length of the grind can be frustrating, but then that has fuck all to do with ffa pvp mechanics.
3. How does a change to health mean that the ffa pvp basis that DF is built on is wrong again? WoW makes changes to it's classes stats, does that mean that its PvE themepark model is broken as well?
A player killing a weaker player in a ffa pvp game is not griefing.
"Come and have a look at what you could have won."
I grinded goblins because I needed that crappy gear to sell for little gold to a vendor to gain enough gold to buy my next skill. You clearly show the vet perspective - what can you lose? 500 gold max? To me, 500 gold = 2-3 hours of grinding goblins, unless someone vet comes in and takes it all away from me. IM A NOOB for christsake, i can't farm 1000000 gold with a single fart, yet.
If it takes you 2-3 hours to farm 500g (as a brand new, freshly rolled character) you are doing it wrong.
A brand new player can make thousands of gold just selling the drops from the Newbie Dungeons to players who need them. These drops, despite what you may think, are in demand by vets and new players alike.
Do you bother to skin after a kill? You should be skinning every single mob, imho.The loot gained from skinning can net you thousands of gold, after a mere hour of farming.
Do you mine? Rare ores sell for 1.2k minimum and range up to 2.5k, more if you sell the ingots instead of the raw ores.This is per single ore, not a stack.
Bottom line, there are plenty of ways for a new player to make a serious profit right from the first hour they step into Agon. You just don't seem to be aware of the methods.
Im a noob, I don't know whats the most efficient way to earn money, I don't know where the best spawns are, I don't know which skills are a must and which aren't worth 100 gold, I don't know how to escape from a fight. And I never will because people gank me and I lose my stuff and any desire to continue playing because I have to do the whole grinding again.
Take the time to do some research and inform yourself? It's not a hard thing to do, you figured out how to use your browser to navigate to this website, I'm sure you can figure out how to use it in order to find pertinent information you lack, regarding the game in question.
Being a noob is completely irrelevant, you could have helped yourself at anytime, you chose not to.
I want to be ambushed by 2 guys and win the game due to MY skills, not my character skills.
Then you are playing the wrong game.
Because character progression is at the core of RPG games (DF is an mmoRPG). If you want to remove the character progression , FPS games is what you are looking for.
... and a MMOFPS is what he very obviously wants it to be. There's no way around it. He wants AV to take the MMORPG they've spent 8+ years working on and change it into a MMOFPS to suit him.
I think I'll go stand in Burger King and complain that they don't sell more Pizza. I mean just because the establishment is focused primarily on hamburgers and has "Burger" in its name, why should I as a customer be shunned? Why should I be forced to eat hamburgers if I really want pizza? And, no, I don't want to go to a restaurant that specializes in Pizza. If I want to go to Burger King and have Pizza, then they should cater to what I want. I *am* the customer after all. There are thousands of people out there who agree with me, but Burger King doesn't listen to its customers and this is why they're not more successful. If they'd listen to anonymous people telling them to change their business model to something completely different than what they're built on, their business would explode.
And don't tell me Burger King is doing fine with their current menu, because that's just stupid. I mean, they're a business, and businesses are in business to make money. It seems like poor business to me to limit your customers by not offering more of what they might want, like pizza. Burger King is doing it all wrong and they need someone (like me) to set them straight so they can be more successful.
"If you just step away for a sec you will clearly see all the pot holes in the road, and the cash shop selling asphalt..." - Mimzel on F2P/Cash Shops
Because character progression is at the core of RPG games (DF is an mmoRPG). If you want to remove the character progression , FPS games is what you are looking for.
Where do you guys come from?
The RPG in mmoRPG is Role-Playing Game, it has nothing to do with the time you need to level your char.
What does a player role-play when he AFK swim against wall?
What does a player role-play when he AFK hit/heals his alt?
What does a player role-play when he is AFK casting spells through the night?
What does a player role-play when he kills tens of thousand NPCs to raise his level?
Darkfall was ment to be a role-playing game, not the endless role-playing grind it has become. This gentleman sums up the failure of Darkfall pretty nice. I wish AV would listen to him and we wouldn`t have to be the microbe we are in the mmo community.
"There's a lot of faith that DF will be fixed with Prestige Classes and that secondary but important changes like a new and easier UI and new communications systems and environmental sounds will bring about a renaissance.
But is this faith justified? The game's population has plummeted radically since launch and is in self-reinforcing death spiral. Why have the developers been so slow to respond in fixing the fundamental cause of the population debacle? As I read the history of changes to this game, only tweaks have been made. Resources have been put into superficial toys (new mounts, etc) instead of replacing broken core game mechanics. Why have the priorities been so out of whack with reality?
What's the crux of the problem?
While it was nice in concept for players to have unlimited and open-ended skill options, the reality is that it's resulted in optimal - and even necessary- character development that's turned into the infamous grind.
The main reason for this situation is the mismanagement of magic, where one needs top-level spells from several different schools in order to be optimally effective in the game. All one need do is read NA1 clan recruiting where there is "limited recruiting" to see the state of the game in this regard- they all require this kind of character.
More broadly, character development is just plainly too slow for anyone other than hardcore players who are willing and able to spend huge amounts of time- and even pay cash for gold and goods to get a leg up, the real dirty secret of this game. Those who started in DF in its first few months didn't have to contend with the vast gap in power as they skilled up through consistent play. For new players, it's just daunting- especially with regard to magic.
What needs to be done.
A world designed for 10,000 players online at a time (or something close to this) MUST appeal to "regular" players- not just the extreme powergaming set. 10,000 players online at peak a time (Sunday nights) probably means 30,000-50,000 paid accounts. Indeed, DF should appeal to even casual players if we are ever to have an NA2 or an EU2. (The hubris of using "NA1" instead of just "NA"?)
This means: the character development system (Prestige Classes?) needs to result in regular players reaching a mature (95-98% finished, excluding higher end crafting) character in around 3 months with 3-4 hours realistic play a day, and that power gamers can complete a toon in around a month if they grind it out hard.
So, yes, imagine a world with 10,000 online at once and 3x-5x as many actives - the huge meta-game that would exist, with every city having hundreds of residents and all kinds of complex war and politics happening 24/7 instead of the dreary emptiness that exists now.
Just imagine: fixing the skill/stat system so that regular people can play this game too."
Because character progression is at the core of RPG games (DF is an mmoRPG). If you want to remove the character progression , FPS games is what you are looking for.
Where do you guys come from?
The RPG in mmoRPG is Role-Playing Game, it has nothing to do with the time you need to level your char.
What does a player role-play when he AFK swim against wall?
What does a player role-play when he AFK hit/heals his alt?
What does a player role-play when he is AFK casting spells through the night?
What does a player role-play when he kills tens of thousand NPCs to raise his level?
I think you're missing the point. No one here is saying those things = RPG. At least I hope not. The RPG comes into play, if you choose to, while you're harvesting, PvPing, crafting, etc. Those activities in and of themselves can easily be done without roleplaying and are by millions of people in many MMOs. RPG can't be forced. People choose to roleplay or they don't. A game with progression lends itself better to RPG, that is if you want a character with history and achievements and so on. A game that is strictly pew-pew with no progression, purpose or even direction does not lend itself to RPG near as much.
Darkfall was ment to be a role-playing game, not the endless role-playing grind it has become. This gentleman sums up the failure of Darkfall pretty nice. I wish AV would listen to him and we wouldn`t have to be the microbe we are in the mmo community.
"Grind'. The definition of this is apparently never going to be agreed upon by all. What you see as a grind, is only a grind because the game is weak in certain areas. To me, I see it as a grind when I focus on it too much. When I try to rush it. You see it as a grind for different reasons. If the game offered more ways to get over the initial hump, then it wouldn't be seen as a grind I'll bet. Offline leveling will hopefully help, but what the game really needs is more sand in the sandbox. This will appeal to both the PvP and PvE crowd.
"There's a lot of faith that DF will be fixed with Prestige Classes and that secondary but important changes like a new and easier UI and new communications systems and environmental sounds will bring about a renaissance.
But is this faith justified? The game's population has plummeted radically since launch and is in self-reinforcing death spiral. Why have the developers been so slow to respond in fixing the fundamental cause of the population debacle? As I read the history of changes to this game, only tweaks have been made. Resources have been put into superficial toys (new mounts, etc) instead of replacing broken core game mechanics. Why have the priorities been so out of whack with reality?
What's the crux of the problem?
While it was nice in concept for players to have unlimited and open-ended skill options, the reality is that it's resulted in optimal - and even necessary- character development that's turned into the infamous grind.
The main reason for this situation is the mismanagement of magic, where one needs top-level spells from several different schools in order to be optimally effective in the game. All one need do is read NA1 clan recruiting where there is "limited recruiting" to see the state of the game in this regard- they all require this kind of character.
More broadly, character development is just plainly too slow for anyone other than hardcore players who are willing and able to spend huge amounts of time- and even pay cash for gold and goods to get a leg up, the real dirty secret of this game. Those who started in DF in its first few months didn't have to contend with the vast gap in power as they skilled up through consistent play. For new players, it's just daunting- especially with regard to magic.
What needs to be done.
A world designed for 10,000 players online at a time (or something close to this) MUST appeal to "regular" players- not just the extreme powergaming set. 10,000 players online at peak a time (Sunday nights) probably means 30,000-50,000 paid accounts. Indeed, DF should appeal to even casual players if we are ever to have an NA2 or an EU2. (The hubris of using "NA1" instead of just "NA"?)
This means: the character development system (Prestige Classes?) needs to result in regular players reaching a mature (95-98% finished, excluding higher end crafting) character in around 3 months with 3-4 hours realistic play a day, and that power gamers can complete a toon in around a month if they grind it out hard.
So, yes, imagine a world with 10,000 online at once and 3x-5x as many actives - the huge meta-game that would exist, with every city having hundreds of residents and all kinds of complex war and politics happening 24/7 instead of the dreary emptiness that exists now.
Just imagine: fixing the skill/stat system so that regular people can play this game too."
Again, I don't think anyone here really disagrees with the thrust of what this guy is saying. I don't. There is a grind in the game, clearly (nearly all MMOs have a grind), but the debate is over how big of a grind it really is and how much faster (if any) character progression should be made. If it's too fast, then you'll effectively reach "end game" quickly and there's nothing left to really pursue after a while. PvPing for shits and giggles will get old after a while. Capturing and defending towns will get old after a while if there's no reason or purpose behind any of it. Like I said before, if there's not enough sand in the sandbox, PvPing for PvP's sake will become tedious and will be no different than an MMOFPS.
I think what most of us that have been posting agree on is we don't want it to become an MMOFPS with no progression, no sense of achievement, danger or excitement. If PvP was strictly consensual and tiered then a big chunk of the free-for-all PvP would be gone. Where's the sense of danger or excitement if you know you're never really in danger? There's no risk!
EDIT: I don't pretend to be the spokesperson for others. If you agree or disagree with what I said, please speak up! It's where I'm coming from and where I think several others are too.
Current: None Played: WoW, CoX, SWG, LotRO, EVE, AoC, VG, CO, Ryzom, DF, WAR Tried: Lineage2, Dofus, EQ2, CoS, FE, UO, Wurm, Wakfu Future: The Repopulation, ArcheAge, Black Desert, EQN
Originally posted by Nizur Again, I don't think anyone here really disagrees with the thrust of what this guy is saying. I don't. There is a grind in the game, clearly (nearly all MMOs have a grind), but the debate is over how big of a grind it really is and how much faster (if any) character progression should be made. If it's too fast, then you'll effectively reach "end game" quickly and there's nothing left to really pursue after a while. PvPing for shits and giggles will get old after a while. Capturing and defending towns will get old after a while if there's no reason or purpose behind any of it. Like I said before, if there's not enough sand in the sandbox, PvPing for PvP's sake will become tedious and will be no different than an MMOFPS. I think what most of us that have been posting agree on is we don't want it to become an MMOFPS with no progression, no sense of achievement, danger or excitement. If PvP was strictly consensual and tiered then a big chunk of the free-for-all PvP would be gone. Where's the sense of danger or excitement if you know you're never really in danger? There's no risk! EDIT: I don't pretend to be the spokesperson for others. If you agree or disagree with what I said, please speak up! It's where I'm coming from and where I think several others are too.
1) Everything gets old, even PVP, regardless how 'deep' you make it.
2) Darkfall is and always was no more than MMOFPS.
3) Where is the risk? Who says there should be some? Let players play them the way they like. Imposing a certain play style, especially the one that is preferred by tiny minority won't get you anywhere.
FFA PVP needs to go away. It severely limits your options, like the one when I can chose if I want to risk the loss or not.
1) Everything gets old, even PVP, regardless how 'deep' you make it.
Please point me to the game that has changing mechanics on a daily basis so as to ensure it never gets 'old. DF gets 'old' no faster than any other game.
2) Darkfall is and always was no more than MMOFPS.
Care to clarify that comment?
3) Where is the risk? Who says there should be some? Let players play them the way they like. Imposing a certain play style, especially the one that is preferred by tiny minority won't get you anywhere.
Who says there should be some? Well AV does and given they are aiming it at players who also feel there should be 'risk' in a game all of those people who play it and stick with it also think there should be some risk. No one is 'imposing' a play style, if you don't want a full loot ffa pvp game go and play one of the multitude of mmos out there that suit what you want. Have you ever stopped to think that by moaing for changes in one of the few ffa pvp mmos out there it is YOU you are trying to impose a certain playstyle on everyone else?
FFA PVP needs to go away. It severely limits your options, like the one when I can chose if I want to risk the loss or not.
People complaining about ffa pvp in a game specficially set up towards ffa pvp need to 'go away' in all honesty. You can choose if you want to risk loss or not simply by playing one of the many mmos that don't have such a risk in them. What you seem to be advocating is that no one who actually wants the choice of ffa pvp and risk should have it.
It beggars belief that people who don't like ffa full loot pvp games would specifically start bitching about the fact that a niche game has it. If every mmo on the market was ffa pvp and they had no choice then I could understand them crying about it, hell if a AAA title for a major 'casual friendly' IP like Star Wars came out with ffa pvp then I could understand them crying as well.
But when it's a niche game that is trying specifically to cater for the players that do like ffa full loot pvp and risk and they still cry about it, then it smacks exactly of one of their own complaints, choice and trying to impose a certain way of playing on everyone.
Take a step back, realise that there are plenty of mmos out there with non ffa pvp, realise that some people actually would like mmos with ffa pvp and realise that you are essentially crying about the fact that a small company is trying to cater for them.
"Come and have a look at what you could have won."
It's not an mmofps though. If you want that wait for the new mount and blade.(or play some of the many mods for half-life there are some that have medieval design in them).
It's clearly an rpg with fps combat style but that's it. That's the only thing about that makes even close to an FPS is the combat and there is so much more to it than that.
Originally posted by bunnyhopper Take a step back, realise that there are plenty of mmos out there with non ffa pvp, realise that some people actually would like mmos with ffa pvp and realise that you are essentially crying about the fact that a small company is trying to cater for them.
That applies for any business though, you just make a product and tell gtfo and call names everyone who is not buying it. That is the trick how to make money.
Take a step back, realise that there are plenty of mmos out there with non ffa pvp, realise that some people actually would like mmos with ffa pvp and realise that you are essentially crying about the fact that a small company is trying to cater for them.
That applies for any business though, you just make a product and tell gtfo and call names everyone who is not buying it. That is the trick how to make money.
Tired of this crap...
What?
AV are telling everyone to gtfo? Really? So you are saying that because they have made a product that doesn't cater to you as an individual (due to the fact they are aiming it at a specific audience) they are a poor company telling you to gtfo?
"Come and have a look at what you could have won."
Again, I don't think anyone here really disagrees with the thrust of what this guy is saying. I don't. There is a grind in the game, clearly (nearly all MMOs have a grind), but the debate is over how big of a grind it really is and how much faster (if any) character progression should be made. If it's too fast, then you'll effectively reach "end game" quickly and there's nothing left to really pursue after a while. PvPing for shits and giggles will get old after a while. Capturing and defending towns will get old after a while if there's no reason or purpose behind any of it. Like I said before, if there's not enough sand in the sandbox, PvPing for PvP's sake will become tedious and will be no different than an MMOFPS.
I think what most of us that have been posting agree on is we don't want it to become an MMOFPS with no progression, no sense of achievement, danger or excitement. If PvP was strictly consensual and tiered then a big chunk of the free-for-all PvP would be gone. Where's the sense of danger or excitement if you know you're never really in danger? There's no risk!
EDIT: I don't pretend to be the spokesperson for others. If you agree or disagree with what I said, please speak up! It's where I'm coming from and where I think several others are too.
1) Everything gets old, even PVP, regardless how 'deep' you make it.
2) Darkfall is and always was no more than MMOFPS.
3) Where is the risk? Who says there should be some? Let players play them the way they like. Imposing a certain play style, especially the one that is preferred by tiny minority won't get you anywhere.
FFA PVP needs to go away. It severely limits your options, like the one when I can chose if I want to risk the loss or not.
1. Yes, but how does that justify not adding any sand to the sandbox? A dev studio would be suicidal to not add new stuff to an MMO after launch. And the more sand you add to the box, the more alternatives you have to gameplay. It's really straightforward. It's not complicated. Why you're essentially arguing against it boggles my mind.
2. Uh... no. Show me where you read that.
3. Wow. If you don't want risk, don't play a full loot FFA PvP game. It really is that simple. There are dozens of other games that are more likely what you want.
FFA PvP is not going away. Learn to live with it or find another game.
Current: None Played: WoW, CoX, SWG, LotRO, EVE, AoC, VG, CO, Ryzom, DF, WAR Tried: Lineage2, Dofus, EQ2, CoS, FE, UO, Wurm, Wakfu Future: The Repopulation, ArcheAge, Black Desert, EQN
Comments
Then you are playing the wrong game.
Because character progression is at the core of RPG games (DF is an mmoRPG). If you want to remove the character progression , FPS games is what you are looking for.
I grinded goblins because I needed that crappy gear to sell for little gold to a vendor to gain enough gold to buy my next skill. You clearly show the vet perspective - what can you lose? 500 gold max? To me, 500 gold = 2-3 hours of grinding goblins, unless someone vet comes in and takes it all away from me. IM A NOOB for christsake, i can't farm 1000000 gold with a single fart, yet.
Maybe It wasn't the wisest way to do things, but I couldn't learn the wise thing because someone poped in and stoped me from playing the game. I had to wait before he went away. I like to explore things, all kinds of things. Tap into archery, magic, melee, try different armors, weapons, fight different mobs, go to different locations. Im a noob, I don't know whats the most efficient way to earn money, I don't know where the best spawns are, I don't know which skills are a must and which aren't worth 100 gold, I don't know how to escape from a fight. And I never will because people gank me and I lose my stuff and any desire to continue playing because I have to do the whole grinding again.
You obviously have never been a noob or you have forgotten how it is to be a noob - curious by everything new, helpless because someone came in and stole your time, angry because no matter what you do - you cannot defeat the menace. Noobs are like little children, everytime you 4-5 shot them and they lose their stuff - you are taking away their candy.
I am the type of player where I like to do everything and anything from time to time.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holodomor - pre-WW2 genocide.
Not remove it, change it - it can be done and its been done.
I already play FPS games, I want to play MMORPG games with FFA PvP and full loot. If I wanted to play FPS id play Planetside. They have progression there even without PvE. Imagine what DF can have if they fix their PvP mechanics. hundreds of thousands of people!
I am the type of player where I like to do everything and anything from time to time.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holodomor - pre-WW2 genocide.
Why are you starting with the noob martyr complex? We all were noobs in-game at some point. My noob experience was different from yours. And others have posted their's was too. So stop making it out to be a noob vs vet perspective argument. It isn't.
As a noob, I adjusted and was fine. I can count on two hands how many times I was ganked in 6 months. What you're wanting is for the game to adjust to you instead of you adjusting to the game.
Current: None
Played: WoW, CoX, SWG, LotRO, EVE, AoC, VG, CO, Ryzom, DF, WAR
Tried: Lineage2, Dofus, EQ2, CoS, FE, UO, Wurm, Wakfu
Future: The Repopulation, ArcheAge, Black Desert, EQN
I played for 2 months with my clan in this game, in the end it wasn't the pvp that was the issue, it was the blatent hacks, non-finished game that was the issue. If there are people here attempting to recruit people into this game that alone says enough about the game. If you can't hold a descent population in your title, ummm there probably is something wrong with your title to begain with.
Pretty much sums that up nicly, let the flames continue!
"The monster created isn't by the company that makes the game, it's by the fans that make it something it never was"
1) sandbox and tiered PvP or restricted PvP are not self exclusive. I tried WAR and AOC and I found WAR to be too much like WoW, while AOC had uninteresting combat style and too linear (very little sandbox).
I guess we have a difference in the definition of sandbox - to me, the more choices I have - the more sandbox it is. One of the definitions of sandbox: "An open world is a type of video game level design concept where a player can freely roam a virtual world". When one player has a freedom to suppress freedom of the other player, that is NOT sandbox. It seems that you think otherwise.
2) I am glad you had a great experience while going through the "hell" levels. usually, "hell" levels are at a higher end of the gameplay, not at the beginning. Shortly speaking (too tired to write the same thing over and oaver, did you even read any of my posts?): if one player forces you to stop enjoying gameplay the way you want it without your consent, that is sandbox for the griefer, but not a sandbox for the victim, that is not Open PvP, that is Anarchy.
3) if DF is working as intended, then why was there a skill gain increase? Why was there health increase? No, DF was not working as they wanted it, and they saw it. They gave it a little change, look at the reception level and do more balancing if necessary. Every game keeps balancing up and down. DF kept balancing things down all the time. Doesn't that tell you they are far from the balance level that will satisfy them? With each patch they make things better and better for people like I. Eventually, they will make it good enough for me to try it again. At that time we will trully have a PvP game, not a griefing game.
I am the type of player where I like to do everything and anything from time to time.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holodomor - pre-WW2 genocide.
When did you start playing?
I am the type of player where I like to do everything and anything from time to time.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holodomor - pre-WW2 genocide.
You may want to try the game again. Hacks are dealt with for the most part. The game is much more stable as it was before. There is a trial.
I am the type of player where I like to do everything and anything from time to time.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holodomor - pre-WW2 genocide.
November, last year.
Current: None
Played: WoW, CoX, SWG, LotRO, EVE, AoC, VG, CO, Ryzom, DF, WAR
Tried: Lineage2, Dofus, EQ2, CoS, FE, UO, Wurm, Wakfu
Future: The Repopulation, ArcheAge, Black Desert, EQN
well coming from you that actually means something, IE you have been around here as long as I have , I might just do that indeed. Still got my account. Thnx, thou if the population is still hurting that doesn't say much for it's longevity, eh I will try it again thou as I liked it for what it is, thou the issues for-mentioned ruined it, hmm... wonder how the old clan is still doing?
"The monster created isn't by the company that makes the game, it's by the fans that make it something it never was"
Sounds like you had a terrible first experience that many of us just never had to go through.
"Mr. Rothstein, your people never will understand... the way it works out here. You're all just our guests. But you act like you're at home. Let me tell you something, partner. You ain't home. But that's where we're gonna send you if it harelips the governor." - Pat Webb
Population is bustling at the moment. Great time to plunge back into Agon.
"Mr. Rothstein, your people never will understand... the way it works out here. You're all just our guests. But you act like you're at home. Let me tell you something, partner. You ain't home. But that's where we're gonna send you if it harelips the governor." - Pat Webb
Ok, but what you are proposing is not the solution.
You are complaining because other players are stronger than you because of character progression, and you want to win thanks to your own skills.
With this you are only adding a greater injustice to the game. Because some players, even if they play 24/24 will always be less skilled than the others. They will never have a chance to catch up.
At least with DF everyone one has a chance to compete (even if less skilled or disabled IRL). Everyone can work on their character. Of course it's not perfect, but neither is a game based on player skill. DF is both.
1. Sandbox with FFA pvp means pvp everywhere for everyone at any time. You can roam about the world in DF, the point though is so can everyone else. No one is 'supressing' you in DF, you are just unlucky enough on occassion to run into people who will kill you, quite why that would be a suprise in an ffa pvp game I don't know.
2. Most people who actually stick with the game realise they are not 'hell levels' and that over the course of your characters development you are not actually killed that often. The length of the grind can be frustrating, but then that has fuck all to do with ffa pvp mechanics.
3. How does a change to health mean that the ffa pvp basis that DF is built on is wrong again? WoW makes changes to it's classes stats, does that mean that its PvE themepark model is broken as well?
A player killing a weaker player in a ffa pvp game is not griefing.
"Come and have a look at what you could have won."
Aventurine has already stated that they will never create alternative rule servers.
So I doubt you'll ever get the Darkfall you want.
... and a MMOFPS is what he very obviously wants it to be. There's no way around it. He wants AV to take the MMORPG they've spent 8+ years working on and change it into a MMOFPS to suit him.
I think I'll go stand in Burger King and complain that they don't sell more Pizza. I mean just because the establishment is focused primarily on hamburgers and has "Burger" in its name, why should I as a customer be shunned? Why should I be forced to eat hamburgers if I really want pizza? And, no, I don't want to go to a restaurant that specializes in Pizza. If I want to go to Burger King and have Pizza, then they should cater to what I want. I *am* the customer after all. There are thousands of people out there who agree with me, but Burger King doesn't listen to its customers and this is why they're not more successful. If they'd listen to anonymous people telling them to change their business model to something completely different than what they're built on, their business would explode.
And don't tell me Burger King is doing fine with their current menu, because that's just stupid. I mean, they're a business, and businesses are in business to make money. It seems like poor business to me to limit your customers by not offering more of what they might want, like pizza. Burger King is doing it all wrong and they need someone (like me) to set them straight so they can be more successful.
and the cash shop selling asphalt..." - Mimzel on F2P/Cash Shops
Where do you guys come from?
The RPG in mmoRPG is Role-Playing Game, it has nothing to do with the time you need to level your char.
What does a player role-play when he AFK swim against wall?
What does a player role-play when he AFK hit/heals his alt?
What does a player role-play when he is AFK casting spells through the night?
What does a player role-play when he kills tens of thousand NPCs to raise his level?
Darkfall was ment to be a role-playing game, not the endless role-playing grind it has become. This gentleman sums up the failure of Darkfall pretty nice. I wish AV would listen to him and we wouldn`t have to be the microbe we are in the mmo community.
From Forumfall http://forums.darkfallonline.com/showthread.php?t=266821
"There's a lot of faith that DF will be fixed with Prestige Classes and that secondary but important changes like a new and easier UI and new communications systems and environmental sounds will bring about a renaissance.
But is this faith justified? The game's population has plummeted radically since launch and is in self-reinforcing death spiral. Why have the developers been so slow to respond in fixing the fundamental cause of the population debacle? As I read the history of changes to this game, only tweaks have been made. Resources have been put into superficial toys (new mounts, etc) instead of replacing broken core game mechanics. Why have the priorities been so out of whack with reality?
What's the crux of the problem?
While it was nice in concept for players to have unlimited and open-ended skill options, the reality is that it's resulted in optimal - and even necessary- character development that's turned into the infamous grind.
The main reason for this situation is the mismanagement of magic, where one needs top-level spells from several different schools in order to be optimally effective in the game. All one need do is read NA1 clan recruiting where there is "limited recruiting" to see the state of the game in this regard- they all require this kind of character.
More broadly, character development is just plainly too slow for anyone other than hardcore players who are willing and able to spend huge amounts of time- and even pay cash for gold and goods to get a leg up, the real dirty secret of this game. Those who started in DF in its first few months didn't have to contend with the vast gap in power as they skilled up through consistent play. For new players, it's just daunting- especially with regard to magic.
What needs to be done.
A world designed for 10,000 players online at a time (or something close to this) MUST appeal to "regular" players- not just the extreme powergaming set. 10,000 players online at peak a time (Sunday nights) probably means 30,000-50,000 paid accounts. Indeed, DF should appeal to even casual players if we are ever to have an NA2 or an EU2. (The hubris of using "NA1" instead of just "NA"?)
This means: the character development system (Prestige Classes?) needs to result in regular players reaching a mature (95-98% finished, excluding higher end crafting) character in around 3 months with 3-4 hours realistic play a day, and that power gamers can complete a toon in around a month if they grind it out hard.
So, yes, imagine a world with 10,000 online at once and 3x-5x as many actives - the huge meta-game that would exist, with every city having hundreds of residents and all kinds of complex war and politics happening 24/7 instead of the dreary emptiness that exists now.
Just imagine: fixing the skill/stat system so that regular people can play this game too."
Again, I don't think anyone here really disagrees with the thrust of what this guy is saying. I don't. There is a grind in the game, clearly (nearly all MMOs have a grind), but the debate is over how big of a grind it really is and how much faster (if any) character progression should be made. If it's too fast, then you'll effectively reach "end game" quickly and there's nothing left to really pursue after a while. PvPing for shits and giggles will get old after a while. Capturing and defending towns will get old after a while if there's no reason or purpose behind any of it. Like I said before, if there's not enough sand in the sandbox, PvPing for PvP's sake will become tedious and will be no different than an MMOFPS.
I think what most of us that have been posting agree on is we don't want it to become an MMOFPS with no progression, no sense of achievement, danger or excitement. If PvP was strictly consensual and tiered then a big chunk of the free-for-all PvP would be gone. Where's the sense of danger or excitement if you know you're never really in danger? There's no risk!
EDIT: I don't pretend to be the spokesperson for others. If you agree or disagree with what I said, please speak up! It's where I'm coming from and where I think several others are too.
Current: None
Played: WoW, CoX, SWG, LotRO, EVE, AoC, VG, CO, Ryzom, DF, WAR
Tried: Lineage2, Dofus, EQ2, CoS, FE, UO, Wurm, Wakfu
Future: The Repopulation, ArcheAge, Black Desert, EQN
1) Everything gets old, even PVP, regardless how 'deep' you make it.
2) Darkfall is and always was no more than MMOFPS.
3) Where is the risk? Who says there should be some? Let players play them the way they like. Imposing a certain play style, especially the one that is preferred by tiny minority won't get you anywhere.
FFA PVP needs to go away. It severely limits your options, like the one when I can chose if I want to risk the loss or not.
It beggars belief that people who don't like ffa full loot pvp games would specifically start bitching about the fact that a niche game has it. If every mmo on the market was ffa pvp and they had no choice then I could understand them crying about it, hell if a AAA title for a major 'casual friendly' IP like Star Wars came out with ffa pvp then I could understand them crying as well.
But when it's a niche game that is trying specifically to cater for the players that do like ffa full loot pvp and risk and they still cry about it, then it smacks exactly of one of their own complaints, choice and trying to impose a certain way of playing on everyone.
Take a step back, realise that there are plenty of mmos out there with non ffa pvp, realise that some people actually would like mmos with ffa pvp and realise that you are essentially crying about the fact that a small company is trying to cater for them.
"Come and have a look at what you could have won."
It's not an mmofps though. If you want that wait for the new mount and blade.(or play some of the many mods for half-life there are some that have medieval design in them).
It's clearly an rpg with fps combat style but that's it. That's the only thing about that makes even close to an FPS is the combat and there is so much more to it than that.
That applies for any business though, you just make a product and tell gtfo and call names everyone who is not buying it. That is the trick how to make money.
Tired of this crap...
What?
AV are telling everyone to gtfo? Really? So you are saying that because they have made a product that doesn't cater to you as an individual (due to the fact they are aiming it at a specific audience) they are a poor company telling you to gtfo?
"Come and have a look at what you could have won."
1. Yes, but how does that justify not adding any sand to the sandbox? A dev studio would be suicidal to not add new stuff to an MMO after launch. And the more sand you add to the box, the more alternatives you have to gameplay. It's really straightforward. It's not complicated. Why you're essentially arguing against it boggles my mind.
2. Uh... no. Show me where you read that.
3. Wow. If you don't want risk, don't play a full loot FFA PvP game. It really is that simple. There are dozens of other games that are more likely what you want.
FFA PvP is not going away. Learn to live with it or find another game.
Current: None
Played: WoW, CoX, SWG, LotRO, EVE, AoC, VG, CO, Ryzom, DF, WAR
Tried: Lineage2, Dofus, EQ2, CoS, FE, UO, Wurm, Wakfu
Future: The Repopulation, ArcheAge, Black Desert, EQN