Howdy, Stranger!
It looks like you're new here. If you want to get involved, click one of these buttons!
Quick Links
Pay 2 win becoming legitimate? Have we really lost our way this much?
This discussion has been closed.
It looks like you're new here. If you want to get involved, click one of these buttons!
Comments
Woehoew random statement again! Please remain at least slightly on topic.
Fere libenter homines id quod volunt credunt.
Among those who dislike oppression are many who like to oppress.
no, cheating is not the same thing as buying a new player for a soccer team.
First of all... A game is not just a game whether it's any game. Name one game that it's players get paid millions upon millions of dollars to play and entertain other people while they play it... Guess what no one.
Sports games are meant to entertain an audience and provide an income and satisfaction to the players or a mixture of each. Cheating is only done by either paying off the opposing team to lose without knowledge to the public, or by using boosters to increase their ability to play
Board games are meant to entertain the immediate players playing where cheating would involve methods not part of the gameplay
Video games are meant to entertain the same way as a board game but are far more interactive... If something is implemented into the game that all players have access to is not cheating in the least. Cheating would be using methods beyond normal methods such as macroing/botting/obtaining third party help/support. Using features implimented and designed to be part of a game is NOT cheating in the least. Just because you're too broke to afford to do it, doesn't mean it's cheating.
Politican A gives any voter $20 to vote for him. Politican A wins. You don't see a problem with this?
I think i'm going to ignore you. Seems kinda points since you're determined at throwing random words at the issue.
Fere libenter homines id quod volunt credunt.
Among those who dislike oppression are many who like to oppress.
Nerf lets try a new approach. If a baseball player buys a new pair of cleats so he can run faster, which is allowed by the league, is this also cheating in your mind?
I am trying this last time to attempt to find a glimmer of reason behind your blind rage. If you are still adament that using the mechanics of a game as designed is cheating, then I will stop posting in this thread and let you have it. At this point all we are doing is help you inflate your thread-count with one sentence posts.
your point about politicians doesn't make sense, for the same reason all of your others don't. In this example, it would be cheating since they aren't allowed to do so by law. In the games, they are allowed and encouraged to do so.
You are playing a minor league baseball game, you, you pay the umpire $20 to get an automatic walk. Who said anything about a major league baseball game?
Obviously not considering that's how most policians operate... If you knew anything about North America you would know that everyone is generally bought... Their opinions, views, support, respect, you name it is purchased...
Stop trying to rationalize cheating. Cheating is for losers, especially cheating in video games gawd how pathetic.
Nerf as it was stated before by a person who got wrongfully banned when you should have been... You obviously cheat while you play games, being such an extremist you are, the only way for you to feel good about yourself is to show constant disrespect and flame everyone who doesn't agree with you. Does it make you feel good to put down others views and opinions? Do you really think that anyone cares about you're halfassed retarded statements?
So it's extreme to think someone who buys gold in a video game is a f'ing pathetic, cause they are f'ing pathetic, it's so f'ing pathetic it negatively effects my mood. and "banned" what are you talking about?
xS0u1zx got banned earlier for flaming you, when he clearly didn't... If you read it from his alt toon before it got deleted by a mod. Buying illegal gold and going through illegal methods in a game to gain an advantage I agree with you it's pathetic. But if it's PART of the game and intended as a feature then no it's fine as everyone has an equal opportunity to take part in it. Just because people get that advantage doesn't mean their skill grows with it. You can't buy skill, so let them have their shinies and look like retarded morons when they play while you kick their ass in low level gear. Think of the pride you would have then... See this as an opportunity not a curse
Secondly is the "extremist" part if the examples that you use. Like people have the absolute option of paying to literally win. The term "Pay to win" Means that having money makes you powerful, and gives you a greater advantage to the game. It doesn't exactly mean you will win. There is no "Paying an umpire $20 to walk you" It would be like, paying a company for a better bat instead of making your own.. or buying a very expensive pair of shoes that lets you run faster then the others who got crappy shoes. It's small advantages that grow into bigger ones. Not "Here I'll pay you $20 to let me beat you"
Of course there is no greasing the umpire's hand to win, nobody would play the fricking game, it would destroy baseball.
The shoe-bat analogy is a bad analogy, major league regulates those so nobody can buy themselves an advantage. Just like football regulates football, NASCAR, and every other serious sport (game) that exists on the planet, they regulate out cheating.
Yeah I have no idea why they banned him. I completely disagree with many of his viewpoints, but he wasn't flaming. Arguing and debating is kind of the point of this thread.
But back on topic...
I don't really see the difference between buying gold/items illegaly or through the games dev supported system other than the "letter" of the law. The spirit of policy of not allowing RMT is to provide all players with an even playing field and prevent the economy from being corrupted by outside influences like Chinese farmers.
"Legalizing" RMT really doesn't do anything to change that other than make it okay for players to do. So basically, I follow the "spirit" of the law regarding limiting RMTs for gold/exp/items, not the "letter" of the law. Whether it's "legal" or not, I still don't like it.
I actually think it's even worse when it's "legal" because the game devs can profit from bad design.
Are you team Azeroth, team Tyria, or team Jacob?
Then change the gaming world by walking away from games that do this and take your buying power with you. If people don't want these features, game devs won't keep putting them out. Vote with your wallet.
Well I know there's plenty of pay 2 gain advantage games out there that even you would probably enjoy... To be completely honest there's a few good ones. Yes I agree not all games should have the item shop options, but there are some games that actually require it to achieve any sort of gain in the game to catch up to the others that are playing. I know for one I don't wanna play a game for years to try to forever be behind the masses that simply paid to get there... But even paying to get there they had to do a lot of work in the game, even with money you can't be handed everything... After all even people who pay still would rather get things for free.
I think P2W would be closer to steroids in baseball
.
A better bat really is not going to give you that much of an advantage over the normal player. P2W items do give a pretty significant advantage. If they didn't, no one would buy them
.
Are you team Azeroth, team Tyria, or team Jacob?
No you cannot buy yourself an advantage in baseball.
http://mlb.mlb.com/mlb/official_info/official_rules/objectives_1.jsp
1.10
(a) The bat shall be a smooth, round stick not more than 23/4 inches in diameter at the thickest part and not more than 42 inches in length. The bat shall be one piece of solid wood.
NOTE: No laminated or experimental bats shall be used in a professional game (either championship season or exhibition games) until the manufacturer has secured approval from the Rules Committee of his design and methods of manufacture.
(b) Cupped Bats. An indentation in the end of the bat up to one inch in depth is permitted and may be no wider than two inches and no less than one inch in diameter. The indentation must be curved with no foreign substance added.
(c) The bat handle, for not more than 18 inches from its end, may be covered or treated with any material or substance to improve the grip. Any such material or substance, which extends past the 18 inch limitation, shall cause the bat to be removed from the game.
NOTE: If the umpire discovers that the bat does not conform to (c) above until a time during or after which the bat has been used in play, it shall not be grounds for declaring the batter out, or ejected from the game.
(d) No colored bat may be used in a professional game unless approved by the Rules Committee.
Wow, what a bunch of commies, huh. or fascists. Look at them rules.
I agree with your statements about how P2W is bad for the genre and for gaming itself... but your preface is laughable.
P2W is not something new that's plaguing the gaming scene. It is not some "new-fangled rubbish the kids have brought". P2W has been here since forever. I love how you mention D2 and try to villify Blizzard - when all they have done is a huge favour for -everyone- who plays their games. Item sellers using bots and illegal means flooded Diablo 2's game world. P2W was very much part of the Diablo 2 game; this is not something new.
All Blizzard has done is that they have beat the farmers (who were ruing other peoples' games) to the punch. Now, everyone has a chance with competing with the farmers and profiting from it, either via in-game gold (which you conveniently neglect) or real cash. Blizzard cleverly manages to make a profit off this as well - which is a good thing considering how farmers and bots essentially cheated the company and its players with the last game.
With their AH, Blizzard has not only acknowledged the inevitable (item selling for cash), but they have embraced it and made a clever profit from it. More power to them, I say.
"Never argue with a fool; onlookers may not be able to tell the difference."
I need to take this advice more.
Honestly when I first heard of the RMT thing with Blizzard I got excited. For the first time people can actually make gaming a good paying job. Who cares about the game company taking like maybe 5% of the revenue.... I could spend 40 hours grinding items or getting lucky and selling it for real money. Sounds like a great idea for those that can't find work... Think about it that way
I am shocked anyone would disagree with my assertion that a person who buys gold in a video game is a pathetic loser. truly I'm shocked.
*shakes head sadly*
My "They should be..." was an accidental statement of an opinion as a solid rule. My apology for such.
That statement reflects my estimate of perceived value to a consumer for an item at an impulse sale price point. Both the $35.00 xp potions and the $1.50 bargain price point are intentional exagerations chosen to make a simple point. That's why I didn't cite specific game references for either.
My point is that I consider price gouging to be a predatory business techique. It's bad enough that pay to win has infected the MMORPG genre. Adding predatory business practices on top of an already questionable business model (selling the ability to win in a game as a revenue stream) is not something I consider to be reputable.