Definitely. But comparising and making standards by looking at worse companies is not the way to go.
I'm not going to disclose any rl info (before someone asks for it) but in my company if we wait 24 hours (or 15) we loose a customer. The only thing why game companies "can afford" longer response times is due to gamers alone and somewhat skewed mentality many possess. Mmorpg.com quite nicely shows a selection of finest specimen.
More Ad-hominem... I'm sorry but the 24hr thing isn't just something gamers put up with it's something most companies dealing on the internet as whole have embraced as a standard, it's completely logical when you're dealing with anything from 10's of thousands to millions of people's emailed in problems.
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
people who are telling the OP to suck it up are hypocrites plain and simple. as much as i love arenanet, all these login/password problems are absolutely not OK. if you were waiting for 4 yrs to play this game and then were suddenly not able to play it because of a login problem of all things, of course you would be pissed. if you are asking customers to pay for your game up front even before you set a release date, at the very least make sure they can at least get past the login screen. Yes, its a beta and yes there will be bugs, but the truth the matter is that when they made their game public and removed their NDA, they better have a product that is at least somewhat polished and playable, or else they will get terrible press and gw2 will fail even before it gets out of the warehouse.
in my opinion.. and mind that i stated my opinion, this is whats currently wrong and where the pressure comes from, posts like this... the self entitlement is strong in this one, i did have login issues... i didnt nerdrage my pc into a wall, i approached it calmly and took my own steps to resolve it, i didnt google anything, i didnt contact anyone.... i used logic and troubleshot my own problem. I'm no hypocrite, i'm reasonable and logical, i've been waiting just as long as the next guy and for all i knew i was going to miss the beta if i couldnt get it working and i miss tyria, i know what im missing and it's good...
web server issues do not reflect on the state of the game at all and should nor should anyone base a viable opinion of the game off a beta test because it's exactly that and arena net puts in a lot of work between betas having an old version of the client before upgrading and being able to see how many patches they roll out some days.
the fact of the matter is, solutions have been offered and i'm pretty sure the OP has retreated with his tail between his legs realising that his outrage was unfounded and if he did a slight bit of research instead of spewing out that arena net is the worst company in the world.. nay if he even bothered some basic trouble shooting steps he probably would have figured it out like he did, pretty sure if he can work out how to play an MMO he can work out how todo some basic troubleshooting...
ALSO this uhh this egotistical, entitled attitude serves no real purpose.. it doesnt help anyone, it doesnt get results. It just pisses off the patient and logical posters because you decided to rant an opinion which is unjust and overly subjective.
Well said +1
i'm just sick of it man, call me a fanboi i dont care anymore, this generation of self entitled brats who clearly have no real world experience is disgusting and they are the future... well shit, i feel bad for my son that he is going to have these people leading countries...
i want it and i want it now and if it's not working and 100% perfect to my unreasonable standards then i'm gonna flame the hell out of everyone till i get my own way... it's so rediculous and sickening
So, according to you, it is unreasonable to expect a company to provide adequate costumer service after purchasing their product? A prepurchase is still a purchase.
also according to me, it's unreasonable to get up in arms about a product that is currently in testing, which includes the game and online services without a small amount of prior rationale...
The customer service shouldn't be in "testing", it should already be working and ready to go. The beta is for the game, not for the customer service.
Whether or not he has an issue is only one of several aspects. Even if his problem is solved through 3rd party means, it doesn't justify having bad customer service systems in place. One big such is only having live support available during regular business hours for a service used mostly during leisure hours. It is a systematic flaw; they should have live support available for when regular people actually are able to call them.
Furthermore, in the automated letters, they should clearly write an estimation of how much time the customer can expect waiting until they receive a proper non-automated response.
The customer service that was portrayed in the opening post, has clear flaws and the topic starter has every right to feel dissastisfied with the service he has received.
Why are you avoiding so hard the point being made by nearly every poster here, and keep acting so firm in your stance ?
We're not talking about CS efficiency, we're talking about impatience.
1) No, you can't expect the most hyped MMO of the time to provide CS delays shorter than the average, already 7-year old established MMO.
2) Yes, you can find a solution to nearly every problem by using Google, if you're really in a urge.
edit : seeing your post below, you're trying to argue but still acting like a very close minded person. I'm not sure this will lead you to anything else but a conflict.
***** Before hitting that reply button, please READ the WHOLE thread you're about to post in *****
also in regards to my argument, it isnt arena net's support team.. it's NCSoft you should be pissed off at, they're the ones handling it at this point in time aaaaaaand general support rules usually state that you give the people 24 to 48 hours, regardless of a canned reply from probably an automatic service that could potentially link you responses generated on your topic listed (i know they do this i have my own here) aaaaaand beta hasnt started yet, he aint missing anything there is still day and 10 hours to go or so, after beta starts.. sure rage hard until then try and keep a level head
Arenanet are directly responsible for the customer service used for their game. NCsoft is, of course, also responsible.
Whether or not he has an issue is only one of several aspects. Even if his problem is solved through 3rd party means, it doesn't justify having bad customer service systems in place. One big such is only having live support available during regular business hours for a service used mostly during leisure hours. It is a systematic flaw; they should have live support available for when regular people actually are able to call them.
Furthermore, in the automated letters, they should clearly write an estimation of how much time the customer can expect waiting until they receive a proper non-automated response.
The customer service that was portrayed in the opening post, has clear flaws and the topic starter has every right to feel dissastisfied with the service he has received.
OF course, but there's a line that can be crossed in terms of rational reaction and irrational. Someone contacting the BBB so quickly without even waiting the usual amount of time it takes considering internet traffic, is coming pretty close to the latter.
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
So, according to you, it is unreasonable to expect a company to provide adequate costumer service after purchasing their product? A prepurchase is still a purchase.
Well, considering that not having the ability to enter your username and password to be told that there's no beta event running isn't a serious issue to have a grievance about, that less than 24 hours turnaround on a support ticket is better than most other businesses, and that he had at least gotten a basic reply suggesting possible fixes to his issue within that time frame, the customer service seems to be more than adequately responding to the issue.
Whether or not he's already put all the money down on the game, there's no serious issue that has occurred. Nobody is able to play the game that they've prepurchased yet, and claiming that the ability to log into the server and recieve a specific error message is something that you're entitled to do because you prepurchased the game is absurd. It's likely that logins are being allowed before the event starts and verified by that message is intended precisely to find issues like the OP's and be able to correct them before the event starts in the first place, so that issues can be resolved before the event starts with instead of lots of people missing out on part of the beta.
Whether or not he has an issue is only one of several aspects. Even if his problem is solved through 3rd party means, it doesn't justify having bad customer service systems in place. One big such is only having live support available during regular business hours for a service used mostly during leisure hours. It is a systematic flaw; they should have live support available for when regular people actually are able to call them.
Furthermore, in the automated letters, they should clearly write an estimation of how much time the customer can expect waiting until they receive a proper non-automated response.
The customer service that was portrayed in the opening post, has clear flaws and the topic starter has every right to feel dissastisfied with the service he has received.
Why are you avoiding so hard the point being made by nearly every poster here, and keep acting so firm in your stance ?
We're not talking about CS efficiency, we're talking about impatience.
1) No, you can't expect the most hyped MMO of the time to provide CS delays shorter than the average, already 7-year old established MMO.
2) Yes, you can find a solution to nearly every problem by using Google, if you're really in a urge.
edit : seeing your post below, you're trying to argue but still acting like a very close minded person. I'm not sure this will lead you to anything else but a conflict.
Can a person express dissatisfaction about the customer service in any way without you thinking that he is just being impatient?
Whether or not he has an issue is only one of several aspects. Even if his problem is solved through 3rd party means, it doesn't justify having bad customer service systems in place. One big such is only having live support available during regular business hours for a service used mostly during leisure hours. It is a systematic flaw; they should have live support available for when regular people actually are able to call them.
Furthermore, in the automated letters, they should clearly write an estimation of how much time the customer can expect waiting until they receive a proper non-automated response.
The customer service that was portrayed in the opening post, has clear flaws and the topic starter has every right to feel dissastisfied with the service he has received.
Why are you avoiding so hard the point being made by nearly every poster here, and keep acting so firm in your stance ?
We're not talking about CS efficiency, we're talking about impatience.
1) No, you can't expect the most hyped MMO of the time to provide CS delays shorter than the average, already 7-year old established MMO.
2) Yes, you can find a solution to nearly every problem by using Google, if you're really in a urge.
edit : seeing your post below, you're trying to argue but still acting like a very close minded person. I'm not sure this will lead you to anything else but a conflict.
Can a person express dissatisfaction about the customer service in any way without you thinking that he is just being impatient?
Absolutely, sir : by not jumping the gun with extreme actions like BBB report. Did you read the thread, seriously ?
It's like you're only listening to your own voice ... People didn't contest the fact that the OP was pointing at a flaw in CS, people were pointing at his BBB move. It's been written for pages.
***** Before hitting that reply button, please READ the WHOLE thread you're about to post in *****
Whether or not he has an issue is only one of several aspects. Even if his problem is solved through 3rd party means, it doesn't justify having bad customer service systems in place. One big such is only having live support available during regular business hours for a service used mostly during leisure hours. It is a systematic flaw; they should have live support available for when regular people actually are able to call them.
Furthermore, in the automated letters, they should clearly write an estimation of how much time the customer can expect waiting until they receive a proper non-automated response.
The customer service that was portrayed in the opening post, has clear flaws and the topic starter has every right to feel dissastisfied with the service he has received.
OF course, but there's a line that can be crossed in terms of rational reaction and irrational. Someone contacting the BBB so quickly without even waiting the usual amount of time it takes considering internet traffic, is coming pretty close to the latter.
Contacting BBB is a sign of responsability, that the particular customer didn't just think of himself and how it affects him and actually thought about how it will affect others. Contacting the BBB is far better than making a forum post. You should applaud him for actually doing something that at worst will "force" the company to implement better customer service systems.
The customer service shouldn't be in "testing", it should already be working and ready to go. The beta is for the game, not for the customer service.
Uhgg, you seem to be arguing for the sake of arguing at this point. Cs isn't in testing, their systems are.
This is a widespread issue. Meaning there are many tickets coming in about this problem. ANd anyone who has ever dealt with customer service knows you're in a line, and will receive canned automated responses until someone can actually get to you.
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
Whether or not he has an issue is only one of several aspects. Even if his problem is solved through 3rd party means, it doesn't justify having bad customer service systems in place. One big such is only having live support available during regular business hours for a service used mostly during leisure hours. It is a systematic flaw; they should have live support available for when regular people actually are able to call them.
Furthermore, in the automated letters, they should clearly write an estimation of how much time the customer can expect waiting until they receive a proper non-automated response.
The customer service that was portrayed in the opening post, has clear flaws and the topic starter has every right to feel dissastisfied with the service he has received.
Why are you avoiding so hard the point being made by nearly every poster here, and keep acting so firm in your stance ?
We're not talking about CS efficiency, we're talking about impatience.
1) No, you can't expect the most hyped MMO of the time to provide CS delays shorter than the average, already 7-year old established MMO.
2) Yes, you can find a solution to nearly every problem by using Google, if you're really in a urge.
edit : seeing your post below, you're trying to argue but still acting like a very close minded person. I'm not sure this will lead you to anything else but a conflict.
Can a person express dissatisfaction about the customer service in any way without you thinking that he is just being impatient?
Absolutely, sir : by not jumping the gun with extreme actions like BBB report. Did you read the thread, seriously ?
It's like you're only listening to your own voice ... People didn't contest the fact that the OP was pointing at a flaw in CS, people were pointing at his BBB move. It's been written for pages.
See my post above this one, for my opinion regarding the BBB move. Furthermore, I very much doubt that people would not call him impatient even if he had not reported to the BBB, due to the nature of this particular forum.
Contacting BBB is a sign of responsability, that the particular customer didn't just think of himself and how it affects him and actually thought about how it will affect others. Contacting the BBB is far better than making a forum post. You should applaud him for actually doing something that at worst will "force" the company to implement better customer service systems.
lol, you're scary, really. Bringing it to a metaphysical question : Did your parents give you a slap each time you did something wrong ? Or did they try to know if you were trying your best first ?
***** Before hitting that reply button, please READ the WHOLE thread you're about to post in *****
Contacting BBB is a sign of responsability, that the particular customer didn't just think of himself and how it affects him and actually thought about how it will affect others. Contacting the BBB is far better than making a forum post. You should applaud him for actually doing something that at worst will "force" the company to implement better customer service systems.
The BBB isn't going to do a thing unless this is widely reported, considering how few posts like this we've seen, yeah...
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
The customer service shouldn't be in "testing", it should already be working and ready to go. The beta is for the game, not for the customer service.
Uhgg, you seem to be arguing for the sake of arguing at this point. Cs isn't in testing, their systems are.
This is a widespread issue. Meaning there are many tickets coming in about this problem. ANd anyone who has ever dealt with customer service knows you're in a line, and will receive canned automated responses until someone can actually get to you.
However, the customer service has clear flaws and that has nothing to do with whether or not there is a game beta upcoming. The problem is the system used for their customer service. The fact that a beta is incoming, just makes us more likely to be able to spot those flaws.
The customer service shouldn't be in "testing", it should already be working and ready to go. The beta is for the game, not for the customer service.
Uhgg, you seem to be arguing for the sake of arguing at this point. Cs isn't in testing, their systems are.
This is a widespread issue. Meaning there are many tickets coming in about this problem. ANd anyone who has ever dealt with customer service knows you're in a line, and will receive canned automated responses until someone can actually get to you.
However, the customer service has clear flaws and that has nothing to do with whether or not there is a game beta upcoming. The problem is the system used for their customer service. The fact that a beta is incoming, just makes us more likely to be able to spot those flaws.
Which is exactly what testing is for.
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
Whether or not he has an issue is only one of several aspects. Even if his problem is solved through 3rd party means, it doesn't justify having bad customer service systems in place. One big such is only having live support available during regular business hours for a service used mostly during leisure hours. It is a systematic flaw; they should have live support available for when regular people actually are able to call them.
Furthermore, in the automated letters, they should clearly write an estimation of how much time the customer can expect waiting until they receive a proper non-automated response.
The customer service that was portrayed in the opening post, has clear flaws and the topic starter has every right to feel dissastisfied with the service he has received.
Why are you avoiding so hard the point being made by nearly every poster here, and keep acting so firm in your stance ?
We're not talking about CS efficiency, we're talking about impatience.
1) No, you can't expect the most hyped MMO of the time to provide CS delays shorter than the average, already 7-year old established MMO.
2) Yes, you can find a solution to nearly every problem by using Google, if you're really in a urge.
edit : seeing your post below, you're trying to argue but still acting like a very close minded person. I'm not sure this will lead you to anything else but a conflict.
Can a person express dissatisfaction about the customer service in any way without you thinking that he is just being impatient?
also, initially i said that it was poor customer service, when now that i think about it they did offer solutions to his problem while waiting to be looked into and a more direct response be available to his issue, i think that NCsoft handled it fine, my main point that i'm contesting is the kneejerk reaction to post on forums trying to get support for your claim to fame with the BBB and being outright rediculous in the actions.
plenty of customer support teams follow this approach, sending out an automated canned response with troubleshooting steps pertaining to the "issue" that was selected before giving you a proper response after the issue has been looked into.
i take back my comment about the customer service being poor.. seems right on par with where it should be and considering he isnt actually missing any services he should be entitiled to at this point in time, there really is no claim otherwise, after beta has started sure thing.. before it's a pure rant if there was ever a problem to begin with at all
Contacting BBB is a sign of responsability, that the particular customer didn't just think of himself and how it affects him and actually thought about how it will affect others. Contacting the BBB is far better than making a forum post. You should applaud him for actually doing something that at worst will "force" the company to implement better customer service systems.
The BBB isn't going to do a thing unless this is widely reported, considering how few posts like this we've seen, yeah...
If that is true, then his report to the BBB will have no effect, so why is it so bad that he reported there? If the BBB is using certain #complains threshold, that check ought to be automated and extremely efficient, which means that his report didn't waste BBB any time.
The customer service shouldn't be in "testing", it should already be working and ready to go. The beta is for the game, not for the customer service.
Uhgg, you seem to be arguing for the sake of arguing at this point. Cs isn't in testing, their systems are.
This is a widespread issue. Meaning there are many tickets coming in about this problem. ANd anyone who has ever dealt with customer service knows you're in a line, and will receive canned automated responses until someone can actually get to you.
However, the customer service has clear flaws and that has nothing to do with whether or not there is a game beta upcoming. The problem is the system used for their customer service. The fact that a beta is incoming, just makes us more likely to be able to spot those flaws.
Which is exactly what testing is for.
The customer service should already be working properly, this isn't their first game, they should have working systems in place already. The testing is for the game, not for the customer service.
If that is true, then his report to the BBB will have no effect, so why is it so bad that he reported there? If the BBB is using certain #complains threshold, that check ought to be automated and extremely efficient, which means that his report didn't waste BBB any time.
I didn't say anything about the BBB's time, I just view it as a rather rash reaction.
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
my "testing" was referring to account creation / emails etc... web page functionality, i believe the customer service team dedicated to guild wars 2 is a skeleton crew at the moment.
TwoThreeFour, you're an internet bot, I can't see any other explanation to your tunnel vision thinking.
i can.. arguing for the sake of
I am arguing, because several posters are demonizing the topic starter with posts like "This is what wrong with the new generations", "Impatient", "entitled", when I think his actions were perfectly reasonable for what a dissatisfied customer can do.
The customer service should already be working properly, this isn't their first game, they should have working systems in place already. The testing is for the game, not for the customer service.
You realize all of these systems are tied together right? SO yes these things are built along side the game.
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
TwoThreeFour, you're an internet bot, I can't see any other explanation to your tunnel vision thinking.
i can.. arguing for the sake of
I am arguing, because several posters are demonizing the topic starter with posts like "This is what wrong with the new generations", "Impatient", "entitled", when I think his actions were perfectly reasonable for what a dissatisfied customer can do.
read who my reply was directed to.. not the OP at all.. the irrational self entitled person i qutoed before i said what i said... initially i layed down stepping stones for the OP to take to get his account working, please read whole thread before jumping to conclusions
Comments
More Ad-hominem... I'm sorry but the 24hr thing isn't just something gamers put up with it's something most companies dealing on the internet as whole have embraced as a standard, it's completely logical when you're dealing with anything from 10's of thousands to millions of people's emailed in problems.
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
The customer service shouldn't be in "testing", it should already be working and ready to go. The beta is for the game, not for the customer service.
Why are you avoiding so hard the point being made by nearly every poster here, and keep acting so firm in your stance ?
We're not talking about CS efficiency, we're talking about impatience.
1) No, you can't expect the most hyped MMO of the time to provide CS delays shorter than the average, already 7-year old established MMO.
2) Yes, you can find a solution to nearly every problem by using Google, if you're really in a urge.
edit : seeing your post below, you're trying to argue but still acting like a very close minded person. I'm not sure this will lead you to anything else but a conflict.
***** Before hitting that reply button, please READ the WHOLE thread you're about to post in *****
Arenanet are directly responsible for the customer service used for their game. NCsoft is, of course, also responsible.
OF course, but there's a line that can be crossed in terms of rational reaction and irrational. Someone contacting the BBB so quickly without even waiting the usual amount of time it takes considering internet traffic, is coming pretty close to the latter.
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
Well, considering that not having the ability to enter your username and password to be told that there's no beta event running isn't a serious issue to have a grievance about, that less than 24 hours turnaround on a support ticket is better than most other businesses, and that he had at least gotten a basic reply suggesting possible fixes to his issue within that time frame, the customer service seems to be more than adequately responding to the issue.Whether or not he's already put all the money down on the game, there's no serious issue that has occurred. Nobody is able to play the game that they've prepurchased yet, and claiming that the ability to log into the server and recieve a specific error message is something that you're entitled to do because you prepurchased the game is absurd. It's likely that logins are being allowed before the event starts and verified by that message is intended precisely to find issues like the OP's and be able to correct them before the event starts in the first place, so that issues can be resolved before the event starts with instead of lots of people missing out on part of the beta.
Can a person express dissatisfaction about the customer service in any way without you thinking that he is just being impatient?
Absolutely, sir : by not jumping the gun with extreme actions like BBB report. Did you read the thread, seriously ?
It's like you're only listening to your own voice ... People didn't contest the fact that the OP was pointing at a flaw in CS, people were pointing at his BBB move. It's been written for pages.
***** Before hitting that reply button, please READ the WHOLE thread you're about to post in *****
Contacting BBB is a sign of responsability, that the particular customer didn't just think of himself and how it affects him and actually thought about how it will affect others. Contacting the BBB is far better than making a forum post. You should applaud him for actually doing something that at worst will "force" the company to implement better customer service systems.
Uhgg, you seem to be arguing for the sake of arguing at this point. Cs isn't in testing, their systems are.
This is a widespread issue. Meaning there are many tickets coming in about this problem. ANd anyone who has ever dealt with customer service knows you're in a line, and will receive canned automated responses until someone can actually get to you.
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
See my post above this one, for my opinion regarding the BBB move. Furthermore, I very much doubt that people would not call him impatient even if he had not reported to the BBB, due to the nature of this particular forum.
lol, you're scary, really. Bringing it to a metaphysical question : Did your parents give you a slap each time you did something wrong ? Or did they try to know if you were trying your best first ?
***** Before hitting that reply button, please READ the WHOLE thread you're about to post in *****
The BBB isn't going to do a thing unless this is widely reported, considering how few posts like this we've seen, yeah...
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
However, the customer service has clear flaws and that has nothing to do with whether or not there is a game beta upcoming. The problem is the system used for their customer service. The fact that a beta is incoming, just makes us more likely to be able to spot those flaws.
Which is exactly what testing is for.
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
also, initially i said that it was poor customer service, when now that i think about it they did offer solutions to his problem while waiting to be looked into and a more direct response be available to his issue, i think that NCsoft handled it fine, my main point that i'm contesting is the kneejerk reaction to post on forums trying to get support for your claim to fame with the BBB and being outright rediculous in the actions.
plenty of customer support teams follow this approach, sending out an automated canned response with troubleshooting steps pertaining to the "issue" that was selected before giving you a proper response after the issue has been looked into.
i take back my comment about the customer service being poor.. seems right on par with where it should be and considering he isnt actually missing any services he should be entitiled to at this point in time, there really is no claim otherwise, after beta has started sure thing.. before it's a pure rant if there was ever a problem to begin with at all
If that is true, then his report to the BBB will have no effect, so why is it so bad that he reported there? If the BBB is using certain #complains threshold, that check ought to be automated and extremely efficient, which means that his report didn't waste BBB any time.
The customer service should already be working properly, this isn't their first game, they should have working systems in place already. The testing is for the game, not for the customer service.
i can.. arguing for the sake of
lol @ "testing customer service"
I didn't say anything about the BBB's time, I just view it as a rather rash reaction.
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
my "testing" was referring to account creation / emails etc... web page functionality, i believe the customer service team dedicated to guild wars 2 is a skeleton crew at the moment.
I am arguing, because several posters are demonizing the topic starter with posts like "This is what wrong with the new generations", "Impatient", "entitled", when I think his actions were perfectly reasonable for what a dissatisfied customer can do.
You realize all of these systems are tied together right? SO yes these things are built along side the game.
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
read who my reply was directed to.. not the OP at all.. the irrational self entitled person i qutoed before i said what i said... initially i layed down stepping stones for the OP to take to get his account working, please read whole thread before jumping to conclusions