AoC is gonna be so bad who wants to do zone pvp, so terrible. War > AoC all day.
I dont know if Warhammer is like WoW...
But I can tell that the fanboys of WoW are there, we can listen to those younglings fanboys of WoW are now speaking about WH exactly like they speak about WoW... Fear, I feel so much fear...
AoC is gonna be so bad who wants to do zone pvp, so terrible. War > AoC all day.
DAOC is zone based and if it wasn't for the usccess of that game there would be no WAR. Also, WAR is going to be zone based, but not as much. There will be certain "safe" zones for starting toons.
Originally posted by JulianDracosDAOC is zone based and if it wasn't for the usccess of that game there would be no WAR. Also, WAR is going to be zone based, but not as much. There will be certain "safe" zones for starting toons.
True, it will be a bit different. A lot different actually. In DAOC you had to either go to the battlegrounds or out to the frontiers if you wanted to PvP. In WAR 1/4-1/3 of each lower tier zone will be designated for PvP and that percentage increases with each tier. So instead of having to travel across the world to a certain zone if you want to PvP, you'll actually be able to find a fight in your area regardless of where you are in the world.
Don't quote me on this but I'm pretty sure I remember reading or watching a video where it said that the zones would start out with something like 1/4 pvp based... so that you can ease your way into it in the beginning ..
Then it scales upwards until the higher tiers where it will end up being something more like 2/3 pvp based zones...
That way they can keep their promise of being able to PVP 100% of the game if that's the experience you want.. OR .. you can PVE 100% of the game if you so choose.
I don't see anything wrong with that.
As far as WoW fanboys in WAR forums... You start to see more of them nowadays but if you were part of the warhammer alliance forums for a while now like me then you'd know the core group of us who have been looking forward to it are nothing at all like WoW fanboys..
Honestly.. I couldn't care less if it's the least popular game in the history of MMO's .. if it delivers the way we think it is.. then I'd rather play with the core group that I met in the beginning stages anyway.
Having said that I don't think it will be the least popular MMO.. in fact it will probably be hugely popular.. but the less WoW fanboys in there the better I think!
Age of Conan definately looks interesting too but something about it just didn't appeal to me as much .. I'm really not sure what it was exactly... I can't remember all the info now it was a while ago.. I think that you played through it in a NON MMO way first before you actually entered the MMO part of the game?? Are they still doing that?
Also people just talking about riding their horses and chopping peoples heads off.. .. I was like.. great .. so everyone rides around in horses in circles and tries to chop each other's heads off.. except you can't chop other player's heads off.. probably just NPC's .. so.. I dunno..
Like I said just didn't quite hit the spot for me but I think it will probably end up a pretty good game from the looks of it. I'll definately try it out if they have a trial or possibly a beta oppertunity come my way. I won't say it's good or bad till I try it..
But WAR!! That game will be the best I'll say it right now!
But that's just my opinion.. but lord knows I've been playing MMO's since Earth & Beyond .. although I think SUBSPACE should totally count! I think they call it something else now.. Continuum that's it! lol ..
The more that is released on WAR the less I like it. I started looking at AoC once I realized how much of WAR is going to be instanced. It just seems as though you are going to have a few people grind through instances to get most of the points you need to take the zone. Even the final battle to take the city is partially instanced. You have to do these stupid scenarios again and once the door is down then it is no longer an instance and you can have this huge battle of pillaging.
IRvR is just pissing me off. I want open field and I want to lay siege to the enemy capital in the full zone. IRvR just sounds too much like WoW.
We won't know exactly how the game play works and how it will all play out until release, but if WAR is going to fail it is going to be because of this. WAR is too much like WoW and not enough like DAOC when it comes to RvR.
The more that is released on WAR the less I like it. I started looking at AoC once I realized how much of WAR is going to be instanced. It just seems as though you are going to have a few people grind through instances to get most of the points you need to take the zone. Even the final battle to take the city is partially instanced. You have to do these stupid scenarios again and once the door is down then it is no longer an instance and you can have this huge battle of pillaging.
IRvR is just pissing me off. I want open field and I want to lay siege to the enemy capital in the full zone. IRvR just sounds too much like WoW.
We won't know exactly how the game play works and how it will all play out until release, but if WAR is going to fail it is going to be because of this. WAR is too much like WoW and not enough like DAOC when it comes to RvR.
Scenarios are still only 1 of the 4 types of RvR in WAR. Battlefields and Skirmishes are all open warfare. As you pointed out, city seiges in the campaign require initial instancing to breach enemy defenses but, once breached, they too are open. The problem with WoW's PvP instancing is that Blizzard made battlegrounds the only real option for PvP if you wanted any rewards from it. Also, it was the same three redundant objectives over and over again until you wanted to vomit. It was not in any way enjoyable. This left many, including myself, a bit jaded toward the pure mention of instanced PvP. The difference is that WAR's scenarios will each have a purpose and will contribute toward your realm's hold on each zone, unlike WoW's monotonous "I may as well go play an FPS" garbage. Speculation is fine, but please don't base your speculation on the mistakes Blizzard has made. Mythic is a far cry from Blizzard.
As far as WAR being "too much like WoW and not enough like DAOC when it comes to RvR", that's a bit of a stretch for anyone to make based solely upon the inclusion of instanced PvP. There is no RvR in WoW, or really anything even remotely resembling RvR. WoW gave you battlegrounds and that was it (although I know there are some world capture points with BC), but there is no true objective for the PvP system in the game. RvR involves so much more than just having a PvP system. RvR involves a whole world that makes it possible to factually state "Our realm is better than your realm", whereas in WoW, it is merely "Our guild spends more time online than your guild". Sorry to nitpick, but I had to point that out.
Unless something has changedm you have 1 vs 1, group, and zerg. Only the zerg gets you points in open field. The others are all instances. You do need to do all to own a zone. And there is nothing to stop people from killing in open zones. I just think that instances are generally bad and I think they are worse for RvR. Some of the scenarios described are like capture the flag and others that have nothing to do with the actual game (although we are assured that some will). It would be better if everything has just in zones with no instancing.
I agree that there will be plenty more to offer than the instanced PvP we know about in WAR...
I think if most players prefer to fight in the open.. then they will have the oppertunity to do so! 8)
But if people like the idea of Instanced PvP, then WAR will have that too! Also, they'll have it so that you can actually get in and play without waiting for hours! Heheh 8)
But like I said before Age of Conan looks interesting as well.. i'll be sure to try it out when I get the chance! WAR is what I'm personally looking forward to though!
OH Tober! By the way I clicked on your link to Mongbat and I really liked the concept of your guild there... the relatively small numbers and overall tone .. I posted in the welcoming section there 8)
Unless something has changedm you have 1 vs 1, group, and zerg. Only the zerg gets you points in open field. The others are all instances. You do need to do all to own a zone. And there is nothing to stop people from killing in open zones. I just think that instances are generally bad and I think they are worse for RvR. Some of the scenarios described are like capture the flag and others that have nothing to do with the actual game (although we are assured that some will). It would be better if everything has just in zones with no instancing.
I think part of the reason they including some instanced PvP is to even the playing field in terms of realm population. It keeps it from being a constant case of "he who has the biggest zerg wins".
Originally posted by tehking30
pretty sure war will be better than this trash aoc
Comments like this are best kept to yourself. I don't like it when AoC or WoW fans come into the WAR forums spewing crap like this, and I'm sure the regulars here on the AoC boards are just as irritated by ignorant comments such as this one from WAR fans, such as yourself, that give us a bad name.
AoC is looking to have a ton of new solutions to things. It takes everything that works in MMOs and replaces it with a new system. Great something new, but will it work? Im mostly talking about the combat system that looks exciting, yet very questionable. They say it will be very skill based, but from what I've seen its more like uncontrollable slashes. And what about magic, they've released about as much as the Fallout MMO has. Nothing. The graphics are beyond great, though I cant say I like the human models. All in all, there is nothing bad about the game, but there are MANY uncertainties.
WAR takes all the great features that MMOs are known for and builds to it (quest types, PvP modes, city sieges etc). Most importantly, they take away the grind focus and puts it on the PvP. Beyond that, EA Mythic has the funds to make this game as polished as WoW was at realse (in terms of bugs, playability etc). AoC has so much new features to it that it will be next to very hard to make it as polished within realease (this is an educated guess). WAR graphics are good, though still not cutting edge. They seem quite nice to look at, without making your 8800GTX run at 10 fps.
AoC has more potential but who knows if they will deliver. WAR while offering some positive advancements appears to be fundamentally the same as traditional mmorpgs and thus is the safer game.
Bottom line is that Aoc will be revolutionary in maney aspects; formation combat, and the combat system.. This alone will drive more people to atleast try the game, WAR only does the same thing WoW does but backwards, in the sense PvP is more important then PvE. In War the combat system is the same dull thing like in every other mmo out there. Frankly AoC will take more skill then other mmo's and therefore will attract more, new people, like WoW did.
Bottom line is that Aoc will be revolutionary in maney aspects; formation combat, and the combat system.. This alone will drive more people to atleast try the game, WAR only does the same thing WoW does but backwards, in the sense PvP is more important then PvE. In War the combat system is the same dull thing like in every other mmo out there. Frankly AoC will take more skill then other mmo's and therefore will attract more, new people, like WoW did.
Lol I hate to burst your bubble but...
WoW did nothing revolutionary. They simply polished up systems and ideas from past MMO's like EQ, DAoC, etc. The polishing and easy to play style is what attracted more people, not revolutionary ideas.
I applaud Age of Conan for having these "revolutinary" aspects, but having nothing to polish up, I think it's drawing the short straw in being the first of its kind. WAR is yes polishing up many thing, however trying to seperate itself from all MMO's by the RvR systems.
And for the person babbling on about WAR being too instanced... only scenarioes are instanced in PvP. Nice try though. Skirmishes, battlefields, and the overall campaign isn't instanced.
AoC just looks way to slow and boring for me, realistic? who cares i want a game to keep me entertained and fun. The gameplay is what matters to me, i could care less if it was like WOW's graphics, seeing as that they do fine for me and the same with 6 mill+ players. I am not a fan of WOW(I play EQ2) but i would have to say i like some things in WOW better as to what they have implemented in the game. Is there even a ending to AoC? You can always raid and seige in WAR and thats never ending and the developers promised they will keep adding more and more quests, ideas, etc. WAR's quest system allows players to unite and do quests together and when they dont want to, just PVP the hell out of another player if you like that more. Just my 2 cents ^^
Age of conan for me. I won't claim I know everything about warhammer, but it doesn't really seem to have that many new features.
Essentially, Warhammer is NOT pvp in the strictest definition of the term, it is RVR, I'm not sure how it will pan out but it seems that there will only be TWO realms, unlike DAoC where the three realms (Albion, Hibernia and Midgard) really made it a success. It seems to me that the magical 3 may well be crucial for any MMOs that plan to go the rvr route. Warhammer will have many new features and innovations Gameloading, for one thing PvP advancement will be central. I suggest you read the forums and sites in future.
Psychoanalysis appears to show that pain plays no part in the formation of the purposive aspect of the instinct drives.
Here is a copy of the last part of Mark Jacobs (Developer at Mythic) interview. This strikes me as an interesting, honest and "in-perspective" view of the current state of the art with Warhammer. (published on www.warhammeralliance.com)
"I can also tell you that are intent is not to clone WoW or even do WoW 1.5. For some, that is hard to believe I know but that's the last thing I would want to do for the same reason that I haven't put a DAoC 2.0 into production. And let me tell you, given how many DAoC fans there are at EA, if I wanted to score brownie points with the new bosses, that would have been the first thing I did after the acquisition. I want WAR to stand on its own feet and have its own shot at fame/fortune. We're not looking to get WoW sub numbers and that means we don't have to do some things that would make the game more like WoW to achieve those numbers. WAR will be WAR and if anything, it will draw on DAoC more than WoW.
We have lots of new stuff that we will be talking about by the summer of 2007 that will show some of the different directions we are going in then some of the current MMOs. The nature of this industry is way to competitive and derivative to talk about them this early in the process and I've instructed marketing, design and community not to talk about them until much later in the process. I know this may sound like "Secret Tester Version and Features!" from some other games but it isn't. We'll talk about them when we can ensure that they appear in our game before somebody else's game.
In terms of PvP advancement, that was one of the things I wish I had thought more of for DAoC. Our reasoning at the time was to build the communities through PvE advancement at lower levels so that people would have a chance to form friendships, groups, guilds and then they could go into PvP with experience with the game and lots of support. I still believe it made sense back in 2001 and I worry that cradle-to-grave, PvP advancement systems in a hybrid game might work against the building of communities in a new game. Obviously, time will tell."
Psychoanalysis appears to show that pain plays no part in the formation of the purposive aspect of the instinct drives.
As a full time gamer, I have done a lot of research from about just about every MMO that this site brings to the attention of we the masses.
I have done quite a bit of research on AoC, from viewing videos and even ordering & reading a few of the books that the game universe revolves around. I have not done as much backstory research on WAR, but I have been following the game since it went public.
At first glance, I thought AoC was just going to be one of those here today, gone tomorrow MMOs, and that WAR was going to be the greatest thing since sliced bread. So I researched both, reviewing each games posted information, PvP/PvE orientation in each game, and the combat system of both. I also waited for an actual gameplay video to come out for both before making a full decision.
I first saw the WAR gameplay video a few months ago, and I was sorely, sorely dissapointed in it. After playing WoW for a total of 7 months, (2 years off and on), and reaching 4 characters to level 60, I was definatly looknig for something different than WoW endgame. WAR just seems like a MMO that has taken some of the better 'techniques' from WoW gameplay, and a graphics engine that is a step above EQ2, and a step below WoW.
- I sure do enjoy some of the design ideas of WAR with PvP combat being the center gravity point of the game, since that is what I love to do in most endgame environments, but the graphics, and poorly designed settings just dont do it for me. The story doesnt grab me, and I am not really too big a fan of the "high-fantasy settings" that a lot of fantasy MMORPGs to date have taken as a framework.
My gaming friends and I learned a valuable lesson from watching the best video trailers of our short lives for upcoming games, from games like Warcraft 3, RF Online, & Warhammer-online, only to learn that the game itself was no where near the bar we set for it. AoC looks to me like it is going to live up to the hype that many of us have felt when we first heard "The first Adult-Oriented MMO" and " 'real-time' combat".
- The story of AoC grips me, I like the fact knowning that the world is a dangerous place. 1 minute you could be eating and drinking in a god-forsaken pub, and 20 seconds later involved in a fight with 5 guys you stole from the day before, armed to the teeth and ready to skin you bare. I think the realisim of this game and its engine will provide that, and I think a "adult-oriented mmorpg" is something a lot of people have been asking for from the beginning. I bet that there will be enough "killers" out there willing to set it on the line, that Funcom will make some PvP oriented servers, I have no doubt of that.
Far be it for me, some guy on the net you'v never even heard of to say this game is "THE BEST 3/AR", because it takes all kinds. Different people like different stuff.
All im looking for in a fantasy-mmo is a kick ass graphics engine, realistic ass kicking, and a story that you cant put down even when you try.
- For me, this game looks like something I could really get into.
Bottom line is that Aoc will be revolutionary in maney aspects; formation combat, and the combat system.. This alone will drive more people to atleast try the game, WAR only does the same thing WoW does but backwards, in the sense PvP is more important then PvE. In War the combat system is the same dull thing like in every other mmo out there. Frankly AoC will take more skill then other mmo's and therefore will attract more, new people, like WoW did.
Firstly.... War is going to have a lot of strategy in the fact that every character is going to have a uniqe ability that no other class is going to have in the game. There are no full time healers bringing another strat to the bunch. You have to put your skills together and make them work in harmony to stay alive together. I think your stabbing blindly in saying that War's combat system is going to be dull. AoC might be a little more diff and seem a bit more exciting. But I honestly don't think thats any reason to say War is going to be dull.
Also... revolutionary? Maybe, but theres a whole lot of room for screwing up there. And I will no doubt try the game out but I'm just feeling like it's going to be an MMO that crashes on gamers hopes and is another big let down. Someone said it was going to be a here tomarrow gone the next type of game. I couldn't say for sure... and I genuinly hope that isn't the case. But I have to admit those are my fears with this game.
War on the otherhand... after watching the vids I noticed there wasn't much movement. No grantid they were fighting mobs. Which we all know you usually do that without moving around excitedly. Then I watched a pvp video and one phrase came to mind. whoa.
I wouldn't say it's going to be dull unless you've tried beta budd or at leaste watched a few more vids. AoC was the first game I looked at after the DDO disappointment. It's graphics make fairy's dance in my heart and all but we'll just have to wait and see what the game content us like. I must admit it gave me a strong sense of adventure. Because it had a dark and foreboding look to it. Know what I mean? But overall my money sets on the table next to WAR.
AoC is looking to have a ton of new solutions to things. It takes everything that works in MMOs and replaces it with a new system. Great something new, but will it work? Im mostly talking about the combat system that looks exciting, yet very questionable. They say it will be very skill based, but from what I've seen its more like uncontrollable slashes. And what about magic, they've released about as much as the Fallout MMO has. Nothing. The graphics are beyond great, though I cant say I like the human models. All in all, there is nothing bad about the game, but there are MANY uncertainties.
WAR takes all the great features that MMOs are known for and builds to it (quest types, PvP modes, city sieges etc). Most importantly, they take away the grind focus and puts it on the PvP. Beyond that, EA Mythic has the funds to make this game as polished as WoW was at realse (in terms of bugs, playability etc). AoC has so much new features to it that it will be next to very hard to make it as polished within realease (this is an educated guess). WAR graphics are good, though still not cutting edge. They seem quite nice to look at, without making your 8800GTX run at 10 fps.
Bottom line is that Aoc will be revolutionary in maney aspects; formation combat, and the combat system.. This alone will drive more people to atleast try the game, WAR only does the same thing WoW does but backwards, in the sense PvP is more important then PvE. In War the combat system is the same dull thing like in every other mmo out there. Frankly AoC will take more skill then other mmo's and therefore will attract more, new people, like WoW did.
Lol I hate to burst your bubble but...
WoW did nothing revolutionary. They simply polished up systems and ideas from past MMO's like EQ, DAoC, etc. The polishing and easy to play style is what attracted more people, not revolutionary ideas.
I applaud Age of Conan for having these "revolutinary" aspects, but having nothing to polish up, I think it's drawing the short straw in being the first of its kind. WAR is yes polishing up many thing, however trying to seperate itself from all MMO's by the RvR systems.
And for the person babbling on about WAR being too instanced... only scenarioes are instanced in PvP. Nice try though. Skirmishes, battlefields, and the overall campaign isn't instanced.
Unless something has changedm you have 1 vs 1, group, and zerg. Only the zerg gets you points in open field. The others are all instances. You do need to do all to own a zone. And there is nothing to stop people from killing in open zones. I just think that instances are generally bad and I think they are worse for RvR. Some of the scenarios described are like capture the flag and others that have nothing to do with the actual game (although we are assured that some will). It would be better if everything has just in zones with no instancing.
Wtf? The catagories are Skirmishes, Battlefields, Scenarios and Campaigns.
Skirmishes mean that if you kill an enemy, you get points. It doesn't matter how many are in your group, how many are in their group or if you take them by surprise. 1 vs 1, group, and 'zerg'(you can't attack player of lower levels), all get you points.
Battlefields are placer where something happens that'll attract PvP naturally. The example that was given was Dwarf Ruins. Maybe there are some Ruins on the field. Dwarfs will try to recover artifacts from them, while greenskins will try to deficate on and deface them. If the Dwarfs get the artifacts, they get points. If the Greenskins wreck the Ruins, they get points.
Scenarios are instances. It's been said they make up 1/10 of the game content. They're a lot like WoW's, but the difference is that in WAR they'll have a persistant effect. What happens in an instance, won't stay in an instance. If you don't stop the Orcs from cutting down trees, the forest will disapear.
Campaigns are the end game where you attack a city. It's supposed to be a huge mix of PvP and PvE that contribute to RvR.
You don't NEED to do instances to capture a zone. Points are points. The point Mythic is trying to make is that instance runners and people who want a one to one PvP fight(as opposed to open PvP where you can be outnumbered) can contribute to RvR too.
There's Safety Areas within Zones. Not all of it is open PvP. Furthermore, High Levels can't come back into lower levels and PvP.
And as for instances, I don't see how removing content can help a game. Maybe a focus on instances could, but they've said that the instances won't be more than 10% of the game content.
And where the hell do you gather that instances have nothing to do with the game?
"The first scenario is Mourkain Temple. Mourkain Temple is a remnant of the defunct Mourkain civilization. All that remains of the once-mighty complex is half-sunken ruins. Pillars, collapsed buildings, and large swamp trees surround it, obscuring it from the rest of the swamp. The temple itself cannot be entered. However, a wide ledge runs around it, with sets of stairs winding down into the brackish swamp water.
A crafty goblin shaman of the Black Skull tribe recently discovered a strange artifact near the temple. He learned that while he carried this glowing artifact, he became more powerful in battle, as long as he did not stray too far from the temple. The dwarfs, who have clashed with the shaman and his band more than once, have pieced together that the artifact is a source of magical power and must be taken from the greenskins.
The two sides will square off in a battle around the ancient temple to fight for control of the artifact. Walking around in this terrain, you'll find that it's definitely a close-quarter combat zone. That's not to say there isn't room for ranged combat, but the metal meets the meat here, more often than not! The backbone of this scenario is team deathmatch with a variable thrown in to give you more points. That variable is the Mourkain Temple artifact. When you have this artifact, your kills will give you more bang for your buck...but if you're killed, the other realm can grab the artifact and get that same bonus for itself! "
It's still killing your enemies ^. That's in essense what WAR is about. It has everything to do with the game.
"The second scenario is the gyrocopter rescue. A squadron of gyrocopters from the king's flying corps has been dispatched to Kadrin Valley, where Slayer Keep has come under attack by the greenskins. As the gyrocopters draw near Slayer Keep, a storm forces the gyrocopters to the ground.
Rescuing comrades from crashed gyrocopters will be the goal of this scenario.
The gyrocopters are damaged but not destroyed. Among themselves, the pilots decide one of them will go for help to Slayer Keep. A rescue party is sent to repair the downed gyrocopters so that they might aid in the fight against the greenskins.
While the rescue team makes its way back to the gyrocopters, goblin scouts stumble upon the crash site and eagerly return with the news to their boss. The greenskins assemble a warband to deal with the dwarf pilots and see what can be scavenged from their vehicles.
The two sides will fight for control over the downed gyrocopters amidst tall trees, rocky outcroppings, destroyed ruins, waterfalls, flatlands, and on a dwarven bridge! This zone is in stark contrast to Mourkain Temple in terms of feel and gameplay. At its core, this is a battle to hold more locations than your opponent and kill the enemy in the process. A few locations are close-quarter battles, but the majority of this scenario is an open field and standoff paradise! "
It's about resquing your allies before Orcs slaughter them! How does that not have to do with the game!?
Comments
But I can tell that the fanboys of WoW are there, we can listen to those younglings fanboys of WoW are now speaking about WH exactly like they speak about WoW... Fear, I feel so much fear...
Proud Member of Mongbat
Don't quote me on this but I'm pretty sure I remember reading or watching a video where it said that the zones would start out with something like 1/4 pvp based... so that you can ease your way into it in the beginning ..
Then it scales upwards until the higher tiers where it will end up being something more like 2/3 pvp based zones...
That way they can keep their promise of being able to PVP 100% of the game if that's the experience you want.. OR .. you can PVE 100% of the game if you so choose.
I don't see anything wrong with that.
As far as WoW fanboys in WAR forums... You start to see more of them nowadays but if you were part of the warhammer alliance forums for a while now like me then you'd know the core group of us who have been looking forward to it are nothing at all like WoW fanboys..
Honestly.. I couldn't care less if it's the least popular game in the history of MMO's .. if it delivers the way we think it is.. then I'd rather play with the core group that I met in the beginning stages anyway.
Having said that I don't think it will be the least popular MMO.. in fact it will probably be hugely popular.. but the less WoW fanboys in there the better I think!
Age of Conan definately looks interesting too but something about it just didn't appeal to me as much .. I'm really not sure what it was exactly... I can't remember all the info now it was a while ago.. I think that you played through it in a NON MMO way first before you actually entered the MMO part of the game?? Are they still doing that?
Also people just talking about riding their horses and chopping peoples heads off.. .. I was like.. great .. so everyone rides around in horses in circles and tries to chop each other's heads off.. except you can't chop other player's heads off.. probably just NPC's .. so.. I dunno..
Like I said just didn't quite hit the spot for me but I think it will probably end up a pretty good game from the looks of it. I'll definately try it out if they have a trial or possibly a beta oppertunity come my way. I won't say it's good or bad till I try it..
But WAR!! That game will be the best I'll say it right now!
But that's just my opinion.. but lord knows I've been playing MMO's since Earth & Beyond .. although I think SUBSPACE should totally count! I think they call it something else now.. Continuum that's it! lol ..
Ciao!
IRvR is just pissing me off. I want open field and I want to lay siege to the enemy capital in the full zone. IRvR just sounds too much like WoW.
We won't know exactly how the game play works and how it will all play out until release, but if WAR is going to fail it is going to be because of this. WAR is too much like WoW and not enough like DAOC when it comes to RvR.
As far as WAR being "too much like WoW and not enough like DAOC when it comes to RvR", that's a bit of a stretch for anyone to make based solely upon the inclusion of instanced PvP. There is no RvR in WoW, or really anything even remotely resembling RvR. WoW gave you battlegrounds and that was it (although I know there are some world capture points with BC), but there is no true objective for the PvP system in the game. RvR involves so much more than just having a PvP system. RvR involves a whole world that makes it possible to factually state "Our realm is better than your realm", whereas in WoW, it is merely "Our guild spends more time online than your guild". Sorry to nitpick, but I had to point that out.
Proud Member of Mongbat
I agree that there will be plenty more to offer than the instanced PvP we know about in WAR...
I think if most players prefer to fight in the open.. then they will have the oppertunity to do so! 8)
But if people like the idea of Instanced PvP, then WAR will have that too! Also, they'll have it so that you can actually get in and play without waiting for hours! Heheh 8)
But like I said before Age of Conan looks interesting as well.. i'll be sure to try it out when I get the chance! WAR is what I'm personally looking forward to though!
OH Tober! By the way I clicked on your link to Mongbat and I really liked the concept of your guild there... the relatively small numbers and overall tone .. I posted in the welcoming section there 8)
I'm thinking of possibly applying.
Ciao!
Comments like this are best kept to yourself. I don't like it when AoC or WoW fans come into the WAR forums spewing crap like this, and I'm sure the regulars here on the AoC boards are just as irritated by ignorant comments such as this one from WAR fans, such as yourself, that give us a bad name.
Proud Member of Mongbat
AoC is looking to have a ton of new solutions to things. It takes everything that works in MMOs and replaces it with a new system. Great something new, but will it work? Im mostly talking about the combat system that looks exciting, yet very questionable. They say it will be very skill based, but from what I've seen its more like uncontrollable slashes. And what about magic, they've released about as much as the Fallout MMO has. Nothing.
The graphics are beyond great, though I cant say I like the human models.
All in all, there is nothing bad about the game, but there are MANY uncertainties.
WAR takes all the great features that MMOs are known for and builds to it (quest types, PvP modes, city sieges etc). Most importantly, they take away the grind focus and puts it on the PvP. Beyond that, EA Mythic has the funds to make this game as polished as WoW was at realse (in terms of bugs, playability etc). AoC has so much new features to it that it will be next to very hard to make it as polished within realease (this is an educated guess).
WAR graphics are good, though still not cutting edge. They seem quite nice to look at, without making your 8800GTX run at 10 fps.
WoW did nothing revolutionary. They simply polished up systems and ideas from past MMO's like EQ, DAoC, etc. The polishing and easy to play style is what attracted more people, not revolutionary ideas.
I applaud Age of Conan for having these "revolutinary" aspects, but having nothing to polish up, I think it's drawing the short straw in being the first of its kind. WAR is yes polishing up many thing, however trying to seperate itself from all MMO's by the RvR systems.
And for the person babbling on about WAR being too instanced... only scenarioes are instanced in PvP. Nice try though. Skirmishes, battlefields, and the overall campaign isn't instanced.
Psychoanalysis appears to show that pain plays no part in the formation of the purposive aspect of the instinct drives.
Here is a copy of the last part of Mark Jacobs (Developer at Mythic) interview. This strikes me as an interesting, honest and "in-perspective" view of the current state of the art with Warhammer. (published on www.warhammeralliance.com)
"I can also tell you that are intent is not to clone WoW or even do WoW 1.5. For some, that is hard to believe I know but that's the last thing I would want to do for the same reason that I haven't put a DAoC 2.0 into production. And let me tell you, given how many DAoC fans there are at EA, if I wanted to score brownie points with the new bosses, that would have been the first thing I did after the acquisition. I want WAR to stand on its own feet and have its own shot at fame/fortune. We're not looking to get WoW sub numbers and that means we don't have to do some things that would make the game more like WoW to achieve those numbers. WAR will be WAR and if anything, it will draw on DAoC more than WoW.
We have lots of new stuff that we will be talking about by the summer of 2007 that will show some of the different directions we are going in then some of the current MMOs. The nature of this industry is way to competitive and derivative to talk about them this early in the process and I've instructed marketing, design and community not to talk about them until much later in the process. I know this may sound like "Secret Tester Version and Features!" from some other games but it isn't. We'll talk about them when we can ensure that they appear in our game before somebody else's game.
In terms of PvP advancement, that was one of the things I wish I had thought more of for DAoC. Our reasoning at the time was to build the communities through PvE advancement at lower levels so that people would have a chance to form friendships, groups, guilds and then they could go into PvP with experience with the game and lots of support. I still believe it made sense back in 2001 and I worry that cradle-to-grave, PvP advancement systems in a hybrid game might work against the building of communities in a new game. Obviously, time will tell."
Psychoanalysis appears to show that pain plays no part in the formation of the purposive aspect of the instinct drives.
As a full time gamer, I have done a lot of research from about just about every MMO that this site brings to the attention of we the masses.
I have done quite a bit of research on AoC, from viewing videos and even ordering & reading a few of the books that the game universe revolves around. I have not done as much backstory research on WAR, but I have been following the game since it went public.
At first glance, I thought AoC was just going to be one of those here today, gone tomorrow MMOs, and that WAR was going to be the greatest thing since sliced bread. So I researched both, reviewing each games posted information, PvP/PvE orientation in each game, and the combat system of both. I also waited for an actual gameplay video to come out for both before making a full decision.
I first saw the WAR gameplay video a few months ago, and I was sorely, sorely dissapointed in it. After playing WoW for a total of 7 months, (2 years off and on), and reaching 4 characters to level 60, I was definatly looknig for something different than WoW endgame. WAR just seems like a MMO that has taken some of the better 'techniques' from WoW gameplay, and a graphics engine that is a step above EQ2, and a step below WoW.
- I sure do enjoy some of the design ideas of WAR with PvP combat being the center gravity point of the game, since that is what I love to do in most endgame environments, but the graphics, and poorly designed settings just dont do it for me. The story doesnt grab me, and I am not really too big a fan of the "high-fantasy settings" that a lot of fantasy MMORPGs to date have taken as a framework.
My gaming friends and I learned a valuable lesson from watching the best video trailers of our short lives for upcoming games, from games like Warcraft 3, RF Online, & Warhammer-online, only to learn that the game itself was no where near the bar we set for it. AoC looks to me like it is going to live up to the hype that many of us have felt when we first heard "The first Adult-Oriented MMO" and " 'real-time' combat".
- The story of AoC grips me, I like the fact knowning that the world is a dangerous place. 1 minute you could be eating and drinking in a god-forsaken pub, and 20 seconds later involved in a fight with 5 guys you stole from the day before, armed to the teeth and ready to skin you bare. I think the realisim of this game and its engine will provide that, and I think a "adult-oriented mmorpg" is something a lot of people have been asking for from the beginning. I bet that there will be enough "killers" out there willing to set it on the line, that Funcom will make some PvP oriented servers, I have no doubt of that.
Far be it for me, some guy on the net you'v never even heard of to say this game is "THE BEST 3/AR", because it takes all kinds. Different people like different stuff.
All im looking for in a fantasy-mmo is a kick ass graphics engine, realistic ass kicking, and a story that you cant put down even when you try.
- For me, this game looks like something I could really get into.
Firstly.... War is going to have a lot of strategy in the fact that every character is going to have a uniqe ability that no other class is going to have in the game. There are no full time healers bringing another strat to the bunch. You have to put your skills together and make them work in harmony to stay alive together. I think your stabbing blindly in saying that War's combat system is going to be dull. AoC might be a little more diff and seem a bit more exciting. But I honestly don't think thats any reason to say War is going to be dull.
Also... revolutionary? Maybe, but theres a whole lot of room for screwing up there. And I will no doubt try the game out but I'm just feeling like it's going to be an MMO that crashes on gamers hopes and is another big let down. Someone said it was going to be a here tomarrow gone the next type of game. I couldn't say for sure... and I genuinly hope that isn't the case. But I have to admit those are my fears with this game.
War on the otherhand... after watching the vids I noticed there wasn't much movement. No grantid they were fighting mobs. Which we all know you usually do that without moving around excitedly. Then I watched a pvp video and one phrase came to mind. whoa.
I wouldn't say it's going to be dull unless you've tried beta budd or at leaste watched a few more vids. AoC was the first game I looked at after the DDO disappointment. It's graphics make fairy's dance in my heart and all but we'll just have to wait and see what the game content us like. I must admit it gave me a strong sense of adventure. Because it had a dark and foreboding look to it. Know what I mean? But overall my money sets on the table next to WAR.
If AoC dosn't work out for you. www.afterworldgaming.com Thats my guild.
Emerald
Emerald
WoW did nothing revolutionary. They simply polished up systems and ideas from past MMO's like EQ, DAoC, etc. The polishing and easy to play style is what attracted more people, not revolutionary ideas.
I applaud Age of Conan for having these "revolutinary" aspects, but having nothing to polish up, I think it's drawing the short straw in being the first of its kind. WAR is yes polishing up many thing, however trying to seperate itself from all MMO's by the RvR systems.
And for the person babbling on about WAR being too instanced... only scenarioes are instanced in PvP. Nice try though. Skirmishes, battlefields, and the overall campaign isn't instanced.
Woot woot. Also a great response.
Emerald
Wtf? The catagories are Skirmishes, Battlefields, Scenarios and Campaigns.
Skirmishes mean that if you kill an enemy, you get points. It doesn't matter how many are in your group, how many are in their group or if you take them by surprise. 1 vs 1, group, and 'zerg'(you can't attack player of lower levels), all get you points.
Battlefields are placer where something happens that'll attract PvP naturally. The example that was given was Dwarf Ruins. Maybe there are some Ruins on the field. Dwarfs will try to recover artifacts from them, while greenskins will try to deficate on and deface them. If the Dwarfs get the artifacts, they get points. If the Greenskins wreck the Ruins, they get points.
Scenarios are instances. It's been said they make up 1/10 of the game content. They're a lot like WoW's, but the difference is that in WAR they'll have a persistant effect. What happens in an instance, won't stay in an instance. If you don't stop the Orcs from cutting down trees, the forest will disapear.
Campaigns are the end game where you attack a city. It's supposed to be a huge mix of PvP and PvE that contribute to RvR.
You don't NEED to do instances to capture a zone. Points are points. The point Mythic is trying to make is that instance runners and people who want a one to one PvP fight(as opposed to open PvP where you can be outnumbered) can contribute to RvR too.
There's Safety Areas within Zones. Not all of it is open PvP. Furthermore, High Levels can't come back into lower levels and PvP.
And as for instances, I don't see how removing content can help a game. Maybe a focus on instances could, but they've said that the instances won't be more than 10% of the game content.
And where the hell do you gather that instances have nothing to do with the game?
"The first scenario is Mourkain Temple. Mourkain Temple is a remnant of the defunct Mourkain civilization. All that remains of the once-mighty complex is half-sunken ruins. Pillars, collapsed buildings, and large swamp trees surround it, obscuring it from the rest of the swamp. The temple itself cannot be entered. However, a wide ledge runs around it, with sets of stairs winding down into the brackish swamp water.
A crafty goblin shaman of the Black Skull tribe recently discovered a strange artifact near the temple. He learned that while he carried this glowing artifact, he became more powerful in battle, as long as he did not stray too far from the temple. The dwarfs, who have clashed with the shaman and his band more than once, have pieced together that the artifact is a source of magical power and must be taken from the greenskins.
The two sides will square off in a battle around the ancient temple to fight for control of the artifact. Walking around in this terrain, you'll find that it's definitely a close-quarter combat zone. That's not to say there isn't room for ranged combat, but the metal meets the meat here, more often than not! The backbone of this scenario is team deathmatch with a variable thrown in to give you more points. That variable is the Mourkain Temple artifact. When you have this artifact, your kills will give you more bang for your buck...but if you're killed, the other realm can grab the artifact and get that same bonus for itself! "
It's still killing your enemies ^. That's in essense what WAR is about. It has everything to do with the game.
"The second scenario is the gyrocopter rescue. A squadron of gyrocopters from the king's flying corps has been dispatched to Kadrin Valley, where Slayer Keep has come under attack by the greenskins. As the gyrocopters draw near Slayer Keep, a storm forces the gyrocopters to the ground.
Rescuing comrades from crashed gyrocopters will be the goal of this scenario.
The gyrocopters are damaged but not destroyed. Among themselves, the pilots decide one of them will go for help to Slayer Keep. A rescue party is sent to repair the downed gyrocopters so that they might aid in the fight against the greenskins.
While the rescue team makes its way back to the gyrocopters, goblin scouts stumble upon the crash site and eagerly return with the news to their boss. The greenskins assemble a warband to deal with the dwarf pilots and see what can be scavenged from their vehicles.
The two sides will fight for control over the downed gyrocopters amidst tall trees, rocky outcroppings, destroyed ruins, waterfalls, flatlands, and on a dwarven bridge! This zone is in stark contrast to Mourkain Temple in terms of feel and gameplay. At its core, this is a battle to hold more locations than your opponent and kill the enemy in the process. A few locations are close-quarter battles, but the majority of this scenario is an open field and standoff paradise! "
It's about resquing your allies before Orcs slaughter them! How does that not have to do with the game!?