Originally posted by Gameloading Do you even bother to read my posts before commenting on them? Because my complaints clearly has been that CCP encourages Non-mmorpg.com community members to vote for mmorpg.com's awards Nothing wrong in this unless there is some official law or mmorpg site rule that says otherwise. I didn't know CM also posted this on their website, but my stance remains the same towards CM as towards CCP.
It seems your problem lies in the fact that you belive that to be a member of the mmorpg community you have to post 1000's times here on this site before you are even allowed to vote.
Well let me say this its not up to you how the competition is run. Its up to the owners of mmorpg.com not you. They were the ones who decided that anyone who has registered can vote.
Next you will be joining one of the extreme groups trying to stop certain types from voting full stop.
and here was me, thinking forums were a place to express your opinion. Imo, you don't have to post 1000 posts to be a part of the community, but if your only here to vote for EVE in the awards, then your not part of the mmorpg.com community, simple as that. Again, I think the mmorpg.com awards should be picked by the mmorpg.com community, and not the eve-online.com community.
Anyone who plays MMO's is part of the MMO community, If they sign up to this site just to vote for the awards then they have every right to vote, and their opinion is just as valid as yours and mine. REGARDLESS of which MMO they play or vote for. it's as simple as that. Out of the 540K people signed up here or whatever it is, only a few thousand are really active and the rest are either just here to read the features and news, or to read the reviews when trying to find a new MMO to try. its the same on most MMO official boards, only a fraction of the people who sign up for the game ever post on the boards, its no different here.
Even if they just come here to read the news, they are imo still part of the community. also notice that I say mmorpg.com community, not the MMO community. sure they every right to vote in your opinion, but also keep in mind they wouldn't even vote if CCP didn't ask them to.
I'm also sure the fact your an EVE player doesn't exactly help to give you an unbiased view on the subject either.
my opinion still stands, People who are directed here by CCP and only come here to vote for EVE in the award section are not part of the mmorpg.com community.
To whomever said the comment about EVE being a game of "wits", saying EVE requires wits is like saying Skill based MMO's require no grind whatsoever, it's stupid and it's untrue. Also, trying to make yourself seem smarter by using a game that requires no more skill then making a sandwhich is pretty lame.
Originally posted by Gameloading Originally posted by Minsc Originally posted by Gameloading Originally posted by LordSlater Originally posted by Gameloading Do you even bother to read my posts before commenting on them? Because my complaints clearly has been that CCP encourages Non-mmorpg.com community members to vote for mmorpg.com's awards Nothing wrong in this unless there is some official law or mmorpg site rule that says otherwise. I didn't know CM also posted this on their website, but my stance remains the same towards CM as towards CCP.
It seems your problem lies in the fact that you belive that to be a member of the mmorpg community you have to post 1000's times here on this site before you are even allowed to vote.
Well let me say this its not up to you how the competition is run. Its up to the owners of mmorpg.com not you. They were the ones who decided that anyone who has registered can vote.
Next you will be joining one of the extreme groups trying to stop certain types from voting full stop.
and here was me, thinking forums were a place to express your opinion. Imo, you don't have to post 1000 posts to be a part of the community, but if your only here to vote for EVE in the awards, then your not part of the mmorpg.com community, simple as that. Again, I think the mmorpg.com awards should be picked by the mmorpg.com community, and not the eve-online.com community.
Anyone who plays MMO's is part of the MMO community, If they sign up to this site just to vote for the awards then they have every right to vote, and their opinion is just as valid as yours and mine. REGARDLESS of which MMO they play or vote for. it's as simple as that. Out of the 540K people signed up here or whatever it is, only a few thousand are really active and the rest are either just here to read the features and news, or to read the reviews when trying to find a new MMO to try. its the same on most MMO official boards, only a fraction of the people who sign up for the game ever post on the boards, its no different here.
Even if they just come here to read the news, they are imo still part of the community. also notice that I say mmorpg.com community, not the MMO community. sure they every right to vote in your opinion, but also keep in mind they wouldn't even vote if CCP didn't ask them to.
I'm also sure the fact your an EVE player doesn't exactly help to give you an unbiased view on the subject either.
my opinion still stands, People who are directed here by CCP and only come here to vote for EVE in the award section are not part of the mmorpg.com community.
Where exactly is your justification for this? You've said about 5 different times that all of these "EVE fanbois" come to and sign up just to vote for EVE. Where is your proof? Or are you just making some blind assumption?
Do you even bother to read my posts before commenting on them? Because my complaints clearly has been that CCP encourages Non-mmorpg.com community members to vote for mmorpg.com's awards Nothing wrong in this unless there is some official law or mmorpg site rule that says otherwise. I didn't know CM also posted this on their website, but my stance remains the same towards CM as towards CCP.
It seems your problem lies in the fact that you belive that to be a member of the mmorpg community you have to post 1000's times here on this site before you are even allowed to vote.
Well let me say this its not up to you how the competition is run. Its up to the owners of mmorpg.com not you. They were the ones who decided that anyone who has registered can vote.
Next you will be joining one of the extreme groups trying to stop certain types from voting full stop.
and here was me, thinking forums were a place to express your opinion. Imo, you don't have to post 1000 posts to be a part of the community, but if your only here to vote for EVE in the awards, then your not part of the mmorpg.com community, simple as that. Again, I think the mmorpg.com awards should be picked by the mmorpg.com community, and not the eve-online.com community.
Anyone who plays MMO's is part of the MMO community, If they sign up to this site just to vote for the awards then they have every right to vote, and their opinion is just as valid as yours and mine. REGARDLESS of which MMO they play or vote for. it's as simple as that. Out of the 540K people signed up here or whatever it is, only a few thousand are really active and the rest are either just here to read the features and news, or to read the reviews when trying to find a new MMO to try. its the same on most MMO official boards, only a fraction of the people who sign up for the game ever post on the boards, its no different here.
Even if they just come here to read the news, they are imo still part of the community. also notice that I say mmorpg.com community, not the MMO community. sure they every right to vote in your opinion, but also keep in mind they wouldn't even vote if CCP didn't ask them to.
I'm also sure the fact your an EVE player doesn't exactly help to give you an unbiased view on the subject either.
my opinion still stands, People who are directed here by CCP and only come here to vote for EVE in the award section are not part of the mmorpg.com community.
Where exactly is your justification for this? You've said about 5 different times that all of these "EVE fanbois" come to and sign up just to vote for EVE. Where is your proof? Or are you just making some blind assumption?
Its called common sense. A game of 180k subscriber out-performing a game of 7,5 million subscriber, something is going on. Also, if we can believe these so called EVE fanatics, telling everyone what a good and supportive community they have, then they will vote to support CCP & EVE. its an assumption, yes, but a blind assumption? I think not.
Originally posted by Gameloading Where exactly is your justification for this? You've said about 5 different times that all of these "EVE fanbois" come to and sign up just to vote for EVE. Where is your proof? Or are you just making some blind assumption?
Its called common sense. A game of 180k subscriber out-performing a game of 7,5 million subscriber, something is going on. Yes it's called quality over quantity. Many people who read this site are MMO vets, many of them do not like WoW or have had bad experiences with the game. It's reflected in it's ratings.
Again I'll say it. If all 180K or so of EVE's subsciber base was coming here to boost EVE's ratings, the amount of ratings for the game would dwarf all others, anyone can see that's not the case so the truth of the matter is that a lot of MMORPG.com's readers just don't think that highly of WoW.
I think it's hilarious that so many of you get so angry over the results in a poll on a web site that the vast majority of people who play MMOs care absolutely nothing about.
Where exactly is your justification for this? You've said about 5 different times that all of these "EVE fanbois" come to and sign up just to vote for EVE. Where is your proof? Or are you just making some blind assumption?
Its called common sense. A game of 180k subscriber out-performing a game of 7,5 million subscriber, something is going on.
Yes it's called quality over quantity. Many people who read this site are MMO vets, many of them do not like WoW or have had bad experiences with the game. It's reflected in it's ratings.
Again I'll say it. If all 180K or so of EVE's subsciber base was coming here to boost EVE's ratings, the amount of ratings for the game would dwarf all others, anyone can see that's not the case so the truth of the matter is that a lot of MMORPG.com's readers just don't think that highly of WoW.
If that really was true, then EVE would receive better reviews then WoW, which isn't the case. EVE would also have more subscribers, which again, is not the case. Nobody ever said that all 180k subscribers are here, and saying "But eve doesn't have more ratings then other MMORPG's" is flawed. even if only 1000 eve fans come vote, its already enough to push it on the top, since it imbalances the "good rating - bad rating" balance further.
Originally posted by Nerf09 Players in Eve have over 2 years of realtime skillpoints behind them, they need new fodder to shoot (gank), to make themselves feel superior.
You know, in the month I've been playing Eve, I've not had this ganking issue that everyone seems to go on and on about. I've been blown up three times and pod killed once - mostly in the first week of playing. One of the "blown up" sessions was my own fault for leaving my ECM gear running when I gated into 0.6 space.
Once I figured out the tricks players use for gate camping and how to avoid getting erased in asteroid belts, I've not had to cash in my insurance since.
Oh, and to everyone who beats the Skill Point horse to death: it really doesn't matter much. I've got about 400,000 skill points now and can easily hold my own against 2 year veterans... Just because they have millions of skill points doesn't mean they are "level 60 in full tier 2" to my "level 40 in mixed greens and blues".
You know? That's probably the number one misconception that folks have with Eve - there is no line in the sand that guarantees a 'win' in PvP. Just because one has infinite free time does not give them an insurmountable advantage in the game - and this seems to annoy the afore mentioned infinite freetime folks.
Originally posted by Gameloading Originally posted by Minsc Originally posted by Gameloading Where exactly is your justification for this? You've said about 5 different times that all of these "EVE fanbois" come to and sign up just to vote for EVE. Where is your proof? Or are you just making some blind assumption?
Its called common sense. A game of 180k subscriber out-performing a game of 7,5 million subscriber, something is going on. Yes it's called quality over quantity. Many people who read this site are MMO vets, many of them do not like WoW or have had bad experiences with the game. It's reflected in it's ratings.
Again I'll say it. If all 180K or so of EVE's subsciber base was coming here to boost EVE's ratings, the amount of ratings for the game would dwarf all others, anyone can see that's not the case so the truth of the matter is that a lot of MMORPG.com's readers just don't think that highly of WoW. If that really was true, then EVE would receive better reviews then WoW, which isn't the case. EVE would also have more subscribers, which again, is not the case. Nobody ever said that all 180k subscribers are here, and saying "But eve doesn't have more ratings then other MMORPG's" is flawed. even if only 1000 eve fans come vote, its already enough to push it on the top, since it imbalances the "good rating - bad rating" balance further. If they spent as much time and money advertising as WoW does they WOULD have more subscribers, but that still wouldn't mean the game was any better then it is with 180k subs. Their primary source of advertising is through the free trial and the odd magazine add. That's it. WoW has TV commercials, free trial discs in electronics stores (that you have to pay $3.00 for WTF) and ads plastered pretty much everywhere you can think of. Are you trying to tell me that has absolutely NO effect on the amount of subscribers, or that it is ANY reflection of the quality of the game?
WoW is an anomaly among MMO's. It's highly unlikely that any other MMO will reach anywhere near the numbers that it is doing, even another blizzard title.
Review wise EVE has been doing just fine, the scores it's been getting recently are right up there with WoW's. I'm sure you'll pull up the reviews from 2003 as you alwasy do but they are not valid when talking about the state of EVE currently. It's a completely different game now.
Where exactly is your justification for this? You've said about 5 different times that all of these "EVE fanbois" come to and sign up just to vote for EVE. Where is your proof? Or are you just making some blind assumption?
Its called common sense. A game of 180k subscriber out-performing a game of 7,5 million subscriber, something is going on.
Yes it's called quality over quantity. Many people who read this site are MMO vets, many of them do not like WoW or have had bad experiences with the game. It's reflected in it's ratings.
Again I'll say it. If all 180K or so of EVE's subsciber base was coming here to boost EVE's ratings, the amount of ratings for the game would dwarf all others, anyone can see that's not the case so the truth of the matter is that a lot of MMORPG.com's readers just don't think that highly of WoW.
If that really was true, then EVE would receive better reviews then WoW, which isn't the case. EVE would also have more subscribers, which again, is not the case. Nobody ever said that all 180k subscribers are here, and saying "But eve doesn't have more ratings then other MMORPG's" is flawed. even if only 1000 eve fans come vote, its already enough to push it on the top, since it imbalances the "good rating - bad rating" balance further.
If they spent as much time and money advertising as WoW does they WOULD have more subscribers, but that still wouldn't mean the game was any better then it is with 180k subs. Their primary source of advertising is through the free trial and the odd magazine add. That's it. WoW has TV commercials, free trial discs in electronics stores (that you have to pay $3.00 for WTF) and ads plastered pretty much everywhere you can think of. Are you trying to tell me that has absolutely NO effect on the amount of subscribers, or that it is ANY reflection of the quality of the game?
WoW is an anomaly among MMO's. It's highly unlikely that any other MMO will reach anywhere near the numbers that it is doing, even another blizzard title.
Review wise EVE has been doing just fine, the scores it's been getting recently are right up there with WoW's. I'm sure you'll pull up the reviews from 2003 as you alwasy do but they are not valid when talking about the state of EVE currently. It's a completely different game now.
Actually, I'm talking about the new reviews, and although very high, are still not better then WoW's.
Do you honnestly think the only reason WoW has so many subscribers is because of its advertisement? I live in Europe. there are no WoW tv ads, no WoW t-shirts. and you won't see a WoW commercial before you go to the cinema. even around christmas time, there are zero tv ads, the only thing I noticed were those free trial things in some stores. yet WoW europe has much more subscribers then EVE has worldwide, and when I visit gamespot.com or even microsoft.com, I keep noticing this EVE online advertisement. I will let you think about that one for a while.
Who the hell cares? WoW and EVE are different. Get over it.
I get so sick of people stroking their e-peen over games they play.
EVE is a good game. Some like it, some don't. WoW is a different, but also good, game. Some like it, some don't.
EVE is sci-fi WoW is Fantasy
I just don't get why everyone gets their knickers in a bunch over friggen website reviews/votes. If it bothers you so much post a damn link on the wow forums and ask your cohorts to go vote for WoW. Lord have mercy you people need to GROW UP.
"A ship-of-war is the best ambassador." - Oliver Cromwell
Actually, I'm talking about the new reviews, and although very high, are still not better then WoW's.
Do you honnestly think the only reason WoW has so many subscribers is because of its advertisement? I live in Europe. there are no WoW tv ads, no WoW t-shirts. and you won't see a WoW commercial before you go to the cinema. even around christmas time, there are zero tv ads, the only thing I noticed were those free trial things in some stores. yet WoW europe has much more subscribers then EVE has worldwide, and when I visit gamespot.com or even microsoft.com, I keep noticing this EVE online advertisement. I will let you think about that one for a while.
They're called cookies, if you've been looking at anything related to EVE and go to one of those websites, the site will scan your cookies and try and present ads appropriate to what you have been looking at. You know, targetted advertising.
The newest reviews I've seen for WoW are 2004, 2 years ago....WHEN THE GAME CAME OUT!! If those same sites were to review WoW now, as I've said I doubt they would score it the same.
When you go into a game store do you see WoW boxes on the shelves? How about EVE? How many WoW boxes are there? 5? 10? A whole rack in the middle of the floor? Thats advertising for the game right there.
CCP don't care if they have millions of subscribers and neither does the playerbase. IT DOESN'T MAKE THE GAME BETTER. They bring in enough money to make a profit, spend several million a year on server upgrades, triple their staff and aquire White Wolf games. I'd say that means they're doing pretty damn good. And they didn't have to create a bland, generic game to do it.
Originally posted by Kremlik FYI: It's not just CCP you know, on the RFO site Codemasters are trying to eurge their players to vote also (i'm pritty sure they're doing the same on the DDO front too), I've seen 'vote for X game' topics in their repective sites elsewhere also... Basically IMO this plot to make EVE win is just an excuse to grief EVE, you can't stop anyone from voting the game they prefer, if you don't want EVE to win then VOTE for your repective games and urge others to vote yourself, quit whining about it thats not going to get you anywhere
There you go M8 i reposted this post to remind you in case you missed it.
Seems you have missed it again Gameloading posted this so you can see it M8.
Originally posted by Beatnik59 We can, and we do. Then again, I think I speak for the majority of frequent readers, posters, and contributors to this comminity in saying that the awards under consideration are the MMORPG.com Reader's Choice Awards. What this implies to me is that those who are part of this community are granted, once a year, to recognize excellence in multiplayer gaming. As a new member AramisCEO, with one post, you are given a great opportunity here, as a member of my community, to recognize excellence with us as fans of the genre generally, talking to gamers from all games, and all tastes, in the spirit of fellowship, and to promote higher standards and quality gameplay for all gamers. I can see from your various statements on your sig, and in your post, that you find most MMO games, and most MMO gamers, to be lacking in quality, and sophistication, compared with EVE. In fact, you go so far as to say, "feel free to not play Eve. It's obviously too much of a challenge for you. But do not impune it because you have a case of "sour grapes" (and in case you are ignorant, thats a reference to one of Aesop's tales, assuming you bother to read books!)" Thank you, sir, for coming to this site that has been talking about games long before EVE was even released, and insulting us. It really shows, Mr. one post AramisCEO, what the EVE community thinks about this site, and these readers, for this Reader's Choice Award you came here to support. No, I do not have sour grapes, Mr. AramisCEO. What I do have is a serious problem with the community management at CCP, and in EVE, with regard to this blog: "MMORPG.com has announced that voting has begun for the 2006 Player's Choice Awards. Thanks for our enthusiastic and supportive community, EVE Online kicked some serious award buttocks last year, winning four out of seven possible categories." Tell your community manager, Mr. Kieron, to take it back. You see, in all the fanaticism, and rallying around the EVE fanbase, the EVE management forgot one, very important thing: It is not Kieron's, "enthusiastic and supportive," EVE community, AramisCEO, that determines the MMORPG.com Reader's Choice Awards. It is my community, the community of MMORPG.com, that determines the awards. And while I'm sure that the staff here welcomes all of those who enjoy EVE Online to become a member of this community at MMORPG.com, and even vote for EVE, I'd hope, for the sake of our hosts, that your community, and your community's management, show respect for the community here, my community, who plays EVE, and a myriad of other games, many of which are good in their own right. Yet I'm sure that this is the last we'll hear of you. You see, why the heck would you want to hang out here, with the cheat coders, and the morons? Worst of all, why would you, or EVE for that matter, want an award from a gaming fansite that harbors gamers who are cheating morons, playing button mashing games, who are not "brilliant enough to grasp" EVE? It just goes to show that EVE, CCP, Kieron, and you all sure like our awards, but do not respect the community the awards come from.
Heh, ok, I concede, Kieron wasn't very humble about the rewards given to EVE by the MMORPG.com.
"Pride goes before the fall" they say, and perhaps that pride will bite him in the ass this year.
I don't believe that anyone would be upset if the EVE devs asked in a neutral manner for their players to consider voting in this site, it's open to everyone after all.
There is no evil for any MMO developer or it's community to desire an award. I'm sure there is no disagreement there.
But honestly guys, if you don't like EVE, don't vote for it. If Kieron's comments offend you, likewise, don't vote for EVE. Use it as a rallying cry against EVE, they may need a little humility but for crying out loud...JUST...STOP...COMPLAINING.
It's all good that you don't like EVE. I make no statements about your intellegence, it's a slow paced game that is not for everyone and one's experience, old and new, can vary greatly.
I'll tell you, I voted for EVE where I thought it fitted best into the specific award category, and I assure you I only voted once.
But please, just vote for the game that YOU think deserves the award and let it be. If EVE wins big this year, well, I won't complain. I wouldn't complain if it didn't. But the entire premise about a popular vote is getting your supporters out to do just that, vote, and let the results be. Complaining is pointless, as there is really no concrete, verifiable evidence to back up claims of any type of fraud because is no concrete method open to the users that can substantiate or disprove any theory on how voting and rating occurs on this site (at least as far as I know).
Therefore, let's just let this thread end, and if you want to stem suspected means of defrauding this vote, talk to the MMORPG.com devs about solutions. A example would be to encourage them to limit accounts to one per IP address.
But let's let this thread end, get what supporters you wish to vote wth you, and vote. That's all that really matters really.
Originally posted by Nerf09 Players in Eve have over 2 years of realtime skillpoints behind them, they need new fodder to shoot (gank), to make themselves feel superior.
well i dont think they're gonna find it here, lol! of course i won't be surprised if EVE wins...
Originally posted by Kremlik FYI: It's not just CCP you know, on the RFO site Codemasters are trying to eurge their players to vote also (i'm pritty sure they're doing the same on the DDO front too), I've seen 'vote for X game' topics in their repective sites elsewhere also... Basically IMO this plot to make EVE win is just an excuse to grief EVE, you can't stop anyone from voting the game they prefer, if you don't want EVE to win then VOTE for your repective games and urge others to vote yourself, quit whining about it thats not going to get you anywhere
There you go M8 i reposted this post to remind you in case you missed it.
Seems you have missed it again Gameloading posted this so you can see it M8.
I didn't miss it and I did comment on it. You would have seen it if you actually read my posts before you comment on them.
Its on page 20 of this thread
Originally posted by Gameloading I didn't know CM also posted this on their website, but my stance remains the same towards CM as towards CCP.
having said that, I don't think CM's post has as much influence as CCP's, looking at the number of subscribers compared to EVE's. But its still something I think should not be done. I say mmorpg.com community should pick the awards. after all, its mmorpg.com's readers awards. Not CCP's/CM's.
READ my posts first before you comment on them, LordSlater.
Actually, I'm talking about the new reviews, and although very high, are still not better then WoW's.
Do you honnestly think the only reason WoW has so many subscribers is because of its advertisement? I live in Europe. there are no WoW tv ads, no WoW t-shirts. and you won't see a WoW commercial before you go to the cinema. even around christmas time, there are zero tv ads, the only thing I noticed were those free trial things in some stores. yet WoW europe has much more subscribers then EVE has worldwide, and when I visit gamespot.com or even microsoft.com, I keep noticing this EVE online advertisement. I will let you think about that one for a while.
They're called cookies, if you've been looking at anything related to EVE and go to one of those websites, the site will scan your cookies and try and present ads appropriate to what you have been looking at. You know, targetted advertising.
The newest reviews I've seen for WoW are 2004, 2 years ago....WHEN THE GAME CAME OUT!! If those same sites were to review WoW now, as I've said I doubt they would score it the same.
When you go into a game store do you see WoW boxes on the shelves? How about EVE? How many WoW boxes are there? 5? 10? A whole rack in the middle of the floor? Thats advertising for the game right there.
CCP don't care if they have millions of subscribers and neither does the playerbase. IT DOESN'T MAKE THE GAME BETTER. They bring in enough money to make a profit, spend several million a year on server upgrades, triple their staff and aquire White Wolf games. I'd say that means they're doing pretty damn good. And they didn't have to create a bland, generic game to do it.
Nobody here is denying that EVE is a good game that is doing very well, that is not the issue here.
Indeed, you do still see WoW boxes on the shelves. That is because WoW is still selling a lot every day, and EVE stopped selling years ago, hence it was taken off the shelves. if EVE was selling better, it would still be on the shelves today.
I don't share your opinion that WoW would receive worse ratings, because WoW didn't change. it added extra content, but it didn't change much, hence the review would be exactly the same as before.
I'm also pretty sure CCP DOES care about the amount of subscribers, its why they made a product in the first time. Subscriber base DOES point out how many people enjoy the game, and thats what games are all about
You know, I see a lot of haters out there. Yes, WoW has a huge subscriber base. Yes it sells games and it's "still on the shelves." If you did know about EVE, you would know that EVE doesn't need to be on the shelves, it's a free download, and most places offer a free 14 day trial. It's a good game, I've tried WoW, FFO, and AO. I didn't think they were good games, so I stopped playing them. They weren't my bag.
I got an EvE account, and I fell in love with the game. I do think it's better looking, for the most part, from most of it's counterparts. This is mainly because a game that deals with simple metallic textures and a lot of empty space for an environment doesn't really need the amount of work a game like WoW and FFO need to "look pretty." I'm an EvE fanboy, and I'll admit it. Mainly because the game allows you to play it how you want to play it. It's as complex or as simple as you want it to be.
Now, as far as the logistics of making a sticky post and putting it on the main page, et al...yeah, that's kind of cheap of CCP. What you do have to keep in mind is that CCP is not a major game studio, they don't have the money that Blizzard has to advertise on television, or the huge market pull that Blizzard has to put huge displays up at every game store there is. You can't get people to come to your game if they don't know about it, and this equates to free advertising for CCP.
A secondary affect is that most of the people who play EvE fall in love with it and cancel their other MMO accounts, at least that's been my experience. Those who don't do that typically don't really play the game very long. It's too complex for many casual gamers, it's definitely not for people who like playing dress-up with their elves, and there's no easy way to get really powerful really fast in EvE, and that's yet another reason I like the game. If you see a guy who's had an account for three years, he is going to turn you into a pile of mincemeat even if he's never particpated in PvE at all. Losing your shiny new ship in EvE that you just spent a month saving up for is a tragic loss, it hurts, and it's a serious setback for you and your character. As a result the game has a more visceral joy in PvP than most other games I've played, because you ARE scared. When you pop someone's ship you feel joy not in just winning the battle, but in surviving it.
Best game? I'm not sure, I haven't played them all, but I like it a lot more than the others I've played. Best PvP? From what I've heard from people on EvE who have played other games, it definitely has that.
What I do know is that it's a fine game and almost everyone who plays it absolutely loves it. I can't say the same for WoW, EQ, or UO players that I've known. Most of them have a serious love-hate relationship with their game. The only time I have a love-hate relationship with EvE is when I lose a battleship I forgot to buy insurance on
Originally posted by Gameloading Originally posted by Minsc
They're called cookies, if you've been looking at anything related to EVE and go to one of those websites, the site will scan your cookies and try and present ads appropriate to what you have been looking at. You know, targetted advertising.
The newest reviews I've seen for WoW are 2004, 2 years ago....WHEN THE GAME CAME OUT!! If those same sites were to review WoW now, as I've said I doubt they would score it the same.
When you go into a game store do you see WoW boxes on the shelves? How about EVE? How many WoW boxes are there? 5? 10? A whole rack in the middle of the floor? Thats advertising for the game right there.
CCP don't care if they have millions of subscribers and neither does the playerbase. IT DOESN'T MAKE THE GAME BETTER. They bring in enough money to make a profit, spend several million a year on server upgrades, triple their staff and aquire White Wolf games. I'd say that means they're doing pretty damn good. And they didn't have to create a bland, generic game to do it.
Nobody here is denying that EVE is a good game that is doing very well, that is not the issue here.
Indeed, you do still see WoW boxes on the shelves. That is because WoW is still selling a lot every day, and EVE stopped selling years ago, hence it was taken off the shelves. if EVE was selling better, it would still be on the shelves today.
I don't share your opinion that WoW would receive worse ratings, because WoW didn't change. it added extra content, but it didn't change much, hence the review would be exactly the same as before.
I'm also pretty sure CCP DOES care about the amount of subscribers, its why they made a product in the first time. Subscriber base DOES point out how many people enjoy the game, and thats what games are all about
EVE is not on store shelves because Simon & Schuster Interactive, the games original publisher closed down, after that CCP decided not to sign up with another publisher. I believe there was only about 100,000 or so boxed games ever made for EVE, of which a few thousand are still floating around. They have had the option to release a new boxes on shelves when they brought out a new expansion but they CHOSE not to. They have had buyout offers from all the major publishers (EA, Vivendi, Ubisoft, etc) but CHOSE not to sell out and lose control of their game.
WoW has added a bunch of 40 man raids to the game, something that is hated by all but about 15% of their playerbase, they've added PVP BG, another addition that is almost universally reviled by it's playerbase due to the rediculous grinds they require. Do you honestly think that a reviewer who had played the first 20-30 levels of the game is going to have the same opinion after hitting the endgame grind, or the PVP grind? I sure don't.
CCP always new they would never have a huge subscriber base, actually they are surprised it passed 100K and continues to grow so quickly. They set out to create a living breathing virtual universe where players could build their own empires. At that they've succeeded greatly.
I don't know about you but I don't hold the reader's choice awards or ratings from a site that is so easy to create a 2nd, 3rd or 50th account in high regard. Neither do the major game companies or this site wouldn't need ad sales from gold farmer's to pay their bills.
Originally posted by Pride7 I don't know about you but I don't hold the reader's choice awards or ratings from a site that is so easy to create a 2nd, 3rd or 50th account in high regard. Neither do the major game companies or this site wouldn't need ad sales from gold farmer's to pay their bills.
Originally posted by Kremlik FYI: It's not just CCP you know, on the RFO site Codemasters are trying to eurge their players to vote also (i'm pritty sure they're doing the same on the DDO front too), I've seen 'vote for X game' topics in their repective sites elsewhere also... Basically IMO this plot to make EVE win is just an excuse to grief EVE, you can't stop anyone from voting the game they prefer, if you don't want EVE to win then VOTE for your repective games and urge others to vote yourself, quit whining about it thats not going to get you anywhere
There you go M8 i reposted this post to remind you in case you missed it.
Seems you have missed it again Gameloading posted this so you can see it M8.
I didn't miss it and I did comment on it. You would have seen it if you actually read my posts before you comment on them.
Its on page 20 of this thread
Originally posted by Gameloading I didn't know CM also posted this on their website, but my stance remains the same towards CM as towards CCP.
having said that, I don't think CM's post has as much influence as CCP's, looking at the number of subscribers compared to EVE's. But its still something I think should not be done. I say mmorpg.com community should pick the awards. after all, its mmorpg.com's readers awards. Not CCP's/CM's.
READ my posts first before you comment on them, LordSlater.
Sorry so amny bad posts here ive stopped reading them all.
Comments
It seems your problem lies in the fact that you belive that to be a member of the mmorpg community you have to post 1000's times here on this site before you are even allowed to vote.
Well let me say this its not up to you how the competition is run. Its up to the owners of mmorpg.com not you. They were the ones who decided that anyone who has registered can vote.
Next you will be joining one of the extreme groups trying to stop certain types from voting full stop.
and here was me, thinking forums were a place to express your opinion. Imo, you don't have to post 1000 posts to be a part of the community, but if your only here to vote for EVE in the awards, then your not part of the mmorpg.com community, simple as that. Again, I think the mmorpg.com awards should be picked by the mmorpg.com community, and not the eve-online.com community.
Anyone who plays MMO's is part of the MMO community, If they sign up to this site just to vote for the awards then they have every right to vote, and their opinion is just as valid as yours and mine. REGARDLESS of which MMO they play or vote for. it's as simple as that. Out of the 540K people signed up here or whatever it is, only a few thousand are really active and the rest are either just here to read the features and news, or to read the reviews when trying to find a new MMO to try. its the same on most MMO official boards, only a fraction of the people who sign up for the game ever post on the boards, its no different here.
Even if they just come here to read the news, they are imo still part of the community. also notice that I say mmorpg.com community, not the MMO community. sure they every right to vote in your opinion, but also keep in mind they wouldn't even vote if CCP didn't ask them to.
I'm also sure the fact your an EVE player doesn't exactly help to give you an unbiased view on the subject either.
my opinion still stands, People who are directed here by CCP and only come here to vote for EVE in the award section are not part of the mmorpg.com community.
______________________________________________________________________
Lend a hand and break the chains of regularity you lean so closely upon
It seems your problem lies in the fact that you belive that to be a member of the mmorpg community you have to post 1000's times here on this site before you are even allowed to vote.
Well let me say this its not up to you how the competition is run. Its up to the owners of mmorpg.com not you. They were the ones who decided that anyone who has registered can vote.
Next you will be joining one of the extreme groups trying to stop certain types from voting full stop.
and here was me, thinking forums were a place to express your opinion. Imo, you don't have to post 1000 posts to be a part of the community, but if your only here to vote for EVE in the awards, then your not part of the mmorpg.com community, simple as that. Again, I think the mmorpg.com awards should be picked by the mmorpg.com community, and not the eve-online.com community.
Anyone who plays MMO's is part of the MMO community, If they sign up to this site just to vote for the awards then they have every right to vote, and their opinion is just as valid as yours and mine. REGARDLESS of which MMO they play or vote for. it's as simple as that. Out of the 540K people signed up here or whatever it is, only a few thousand are really active and the rest are either just here to read the features and news, or to read the reviews when trying to find a new MMO to try. its the same on most MMO official boards, only a fraction of the people who sign up for the game ever post on the boards, its no different here.
Even if they just come here to read the news, they are imo still part of the community. also notice that I say mmorpg.com community, not the MMO community. sure they every right to vote in your opinion, but also keep in mind they wouldn't even vote if CCP didn't ask them to.
I'm also sure the fact your an EVE player doesn't exactly help to give you an unbiased view on the subject either.
my opinion still stands, People who are directed here by CCP and only come here to vote for EVE in the award section are not part of the mmorpg.com community.
Where exactly is your justification for this? You've said about 5 different times that all of these "EVE fanbois" come to and sign up just to vote for EVE. Where is your proof? Or are you just making some blind assumption?
There's no way I'm going through this whole thread to read every response, but...
Why doesn't MMORPG.com just make it where the mmorpg.com account has to be a certain age before it can vote for things like this?
Your all starting to scare me.
It seems your problem lies in the fact that you belive that to be a member of the mmorpg community you have to post 1000's times here on this site before you are even allowed to vote.
Well let me say this its not up to you how the competition is run. Its up to the owners of mmorpg.com not you. They were the ones who decided that anyone who has registered can vote.
Next you will be joining one of the extreme groups trying to stop certain types from voting full stop.
and here was me, thinking forums were a place to express your opinion. Imo, you don't have to post 1000 posts to be a part of the community, but if your only here to vote for EVE in the awards, then your not part of the mmorpg.com community, simple as that. Again, I think the mmorpg.com awards should be picked by the mmorpg.com community, and not the eve-online.com community.
Anyone who plays MMO's is part of the MMO community, If they sign up to this site just to vote for the awards then they have every right to vote, and their opinion is just as valid as yours and mine. REGARDLESS of which MMO they play or vote for. it's as simple as that. Out of the 540K people signed up here or whatever it is, only a few thousand are really active and the rest are either just here to read the features and news, or to read the reviews when trying to find a new MMO to try. its the same on most MMO official boards, only a fraction of the people who sign up for the game ever post on the boards, its no different here.
Even if they just come here to read the news, they are imo still part of the community. also notice that I say mmorpg.com community, not the MMO community. sure they every right to vote in your opinion, but also keep in mind they wouldn't even vote if CCP didn't ask them to.
I'm also sure the fact your an EVE player doesn't exactly help to give you an unbiased view on the subject either.
my opinion still stands, People who are directed here by CCP and only come here to vote for EVE in the award section are not part of the mmorpg.com community.
Where exactly is your justification for this? You've said about 5 different times that all of these "EVE fanbois" come to and sign up just to vote for EVE. Where is your proof? Or are you just making some blind assumption?
Its called common sense. A game of 180k subscriber out-performing a game of 7,5 million subscriber, something is going on. Also, if we can believe these so called EVE fanatics, telling everyone what a good and supportive community they have, then they will vote to support CCP & EVE. its an assumption, yes, but a blind assumption? I think not.
Yes
it's called quality over quantity. Many people who read this site are
MMO vets, many of them do not like WoW or have had bad experiences with
the game. It's reflected in it's ratings.
Again I'll say it. If all 180K or so of EVE's subsciber base was coming
here to boost EVE's ratings, the amount of ratings for the game would
dwarf all others, anyone can see that's not the case so the truth of
the matter is that a lot of MMORPG.com's readers just don't think that
highly of WoW.
I think it's hilarious that so many of you get so angry over the results in a poll on a web site that the vast majority of people who play MMOs care absolutely nothing about.
Yes it's called quality over quantity. Many people who read this site are MMO vets, many of them do not like WoW or have had bad experiences with the game. It's reflected in it's ratings.
Again I'll say it. If all 180K or so of EVE's subsciber base was coming here to boost EVE's ratings, the amount of ratings for the game would dwarf all others, anyone can see that's not the case so the truth of the matter is that a lot of MMORPG.com's readers just don't think that highly of WoW.
If that really was true, then EVE would receive better reviews then WoW, which isn't the case. EVE would also have more subscribers, which again, is not the case. Nobody ever said that all 180k subscribers are here, and saying "But eve doesn't have more ratings then other MMORPG's" is flawed. even if only 1000 eve fans come vote, its already enough to push it on the top, since it imbalances the "good rating - bad rating" balance further.
You know, in the month I've been playing Eve, I've not had this ganking issue that everyone seems to go on and on about. I've been blown up three times and pod killed once - mostly in the first week of playing. One of the "blown up" sessions was my own fault for leaving my ECM gear running when I gated into 0.6 space.
Once I figured out the tricks players use for gate camping and how to avoid getting erased in asteroid belts, I've not had to cash in my insurance since.
Oh, and to everyone who beats the Skill Point horse to death: it really doesn't matter much. I've got about 400,000 skill points now and can easily hold my own against 2 year veterans... Just because they have millions of skill points doesn't mean they are "level 60 in full tier 2" to my "level 40 in mixed greens and blues".
You know? That's probably the number one misconception that folks have with Eve - there is no line in the sand that guarantees a 'win' in PvP. Just because one has infinite free time does not give them an insurmountable advantage in the game - and this seems to annoy the afore mentioned infinite freetime folks.
Yes
it's called quality over quantity. Many people who read this site are
MMO vets, many of them do not like WoW or have had bad experiences with
the game. It's reflected in it's ratings.
Again I'll say it. If
all 180K or so of EVE's subsciber base was coming here to boost EVE's
ratings, the amount of ratings for the game would dwarf all others,
anyone can see that's not the case so the truth of the matter is that a
lot of MMORPG.com's readers just don't think that highly of WoW.
If
that really was true, then EVE would receive better reviews then WoW,
which isn't the case. EVE would also have more subscribers, which
again, is not the case. Nobody ever said that all 180k subscribers are
here, and saying "But eve doesn't have more ratings then other
MMORPG's" is flawed. even if only 1000 eve fans come vote, its already
enough to push it on the top, since it imbalances the "good rating -
bad rating" balance further.
If they spent as
much time and money advertising as WoW does they WOULD have more
subscribers, but that still wouldn't mean the game was any better then
it is with 180k subs. Their primary source of advertising is through
the free trial and the odd magazine add. That's it. WoW has TV
commercials, free trial discs in electronics stores (that you have to
pay $3.00 for WTF) and ads plastered pretty much everywhere you can
think of. Are you trying to tell me that has absolutely NO effect on
the amount of subscribers, or that it is ANY reflection of the quality
of the game?
WoW is an anomaly among MMO's. It's highly unlikely that any other MMO
will reach anywhere near the numbers that it is doing, even another
blizzard title.
Review wise EVE has been doing just fine, the scores it's been getting
recently are right up there with WoW's. I'm sure you'll pull up the
reviews from 2003 as you alwasy do but they are not valid when talking
about the state of EVE currently. It's a completely different game now.
Yes it's called quality over quantity. Many people who read this site are MMO vets, many of them do not like WoW or have had bad experiences with the game. It's reflected in it's ratings.
Again I'll say it. If all 180K or so of EVE's subsciber base was coming here to boost EVE's ratings, the amount of ratings for the game would dwarf all others, anyone can see that's not the case so the truth of the matter is that a lot of MMORPG.com's readers just don't think that highly of WoW.
If that really was true, then EVE would receive better reviews then WoW, which isn't the case. EVE would also have more subscribers, which again, is not the case. Nobody ever said that all 180k subscribers are here, and saying "But eve doesn't have more ratings then other MMORPG's" is flawed. even if only 1000 eve fans come vote, its already enough to push it on the top, since it imbalances the "good rating - bad rating" balance further.
If they spent as much time and money advertising as WoW does they WOULD have more subscribers, but that still wouldn't mean the game was any better then it is with 180k subs. Their primary source of advertising is through the free trial and the odd magazine add. That's it. WoW has TV commercials, free trial discs in electronics stores (that you have to pay $3.00 for WTF) and ads plastered pretty much everywhere you can think of. Are you trying to tell me that has absolutely NO effect on the amount of subscribers, or that it is ANY reflection of the quality of the game?
WoW is an anomaly among MMO's. It's highly unlikely that any other MMO will reach anywhere near the numbers that it is doing, even another blizzard title.
Review wise EVE has been doing just fine, the scores it's been getting recently are right up there with WoW's. I'm sure you'll pull up the reviews from 2003 as you alwasy do but they are not valid when talking about the state of EVE currently. It's a completely different game now.
Actually, I'm talking about the new reviews, and although very high, are still not better then WoW's.
Do you honnestly think the only reason WoW has so many subscribers is because of its advertisement? I live in Europe. there are no WoW tv ads, no WoW t-shirts. and you won't see a WoW commercial before you go to the cinema. even around christmas time, there are zero tv ads, the only thing I noticed were those free trial things in some stores. yet WoW europe has much more subscribers then EVE has worldwide, and when I visit gamespot.com or even microsoft.com, I keep noticing this EVE online advertisement. I will let you think about that one for a while.
WoW and EVE are different. Get over it.
I get so sick of people stroking their e-peen over games they play.
EVE is a good game. Some like it, some don't.
WoW is a different, but also good, game. Some like it, some don't.
EVE is sci-fi
WoW is Fantasy
I just don't get why everyone gets their knickers in a bunch over friggen website reviews/votes. If it bothers you so much post a damn link on the wow forums and ask your cohorts to go vote for WoW. Lord have mercy you people need to GROW UP.
"A ship-of-war is the best ambassador." - Oliver Cromwell
Actually, I'm talking about the new reviews, and although very high, are still not better then WoW's.
Do
you honnestly think the only reason WoW has so many subscribers is
because of its advertisement? I live in Europe. there are no WoW tv
ads, no WoW t-shirts. and you won't see a WoW commercial before you go
to the cinema. even around christmas time, there are zero tv ads, the
only thing I noticed were those free trial things in some stores. yet
WoW europe has much more subscribers then EVE has worldwide, and
when I visit gamespot.com or even microsoft.com, I keep noticing this
EVE online advertisement. I will let you think about that one for a
while.
They're called
cookies, if you've been looking at anything related to EVE and go to
one of those websites, the site will scan your cookies and try and
present ads appropriate to what you have been looking at. You know,
targetted advertising.
The newest reviews I've seen for WoW are 2004, 2 years ago....WHEN THE
GAME CAME OUT!! If those same sites were to review WoW now, as I've
said I doubt they would score it the same.
When you go into a game store do you see WoW boxes on the
shelves? How about EVE? How many WoW boxes are there? 5? 10? A whole
rack in the middle of the floor? Thats advertising for the game right
there.
CCP don't care if they have millions of subscribers and neither does
the playerbase. IT DOESN'T MAKE THE GAME BETTER. They bring in enough
money to make a profit, spend several million a year on server
upgrades, triple their staff and aquire White Wolf games. I'd say that
means they're doing pretty damn good. And they didn't have to create a
bland, generic game to do it.
Seems you have missed it again Gameloading posted this so you can see it M8.
Heh, ok, I concede, Kieron wasn't very humble about the rewards given to EVE by the MMORPG.com.
"Pride goes before the fall" they say, and perhaps that pride will bite him in the ass this year.
I don't believe that anyone would be upset if the EVE devs asked in a neutral manner for their players to consider voting in this site, it's open to everyone after all.
There is no evil for any MMO developer or it's community to desire an award. I'm sure there is no disagreement there.
But honestly guys, if you don't like EVE, don't vote for it. If Kieron's comments offend you, likewise, don't vote for EVE. Use it as a rallying cry against EVE, they may need a little humility but for crying out loud...JUST...STOP...COMPLAINING.
It's all good that you don't like EVE. I make no statements about your intellegence, it's a slow paced game that is not for everyone and one's experience, old and new, can vary greatly.
I'll tell you, I voted for EVE where I thought it fitted best into the specific award category, and I assure you I only voted once.
But please, just vote for the game that YOU think deserves the award and let it be. If EVE wins big this year, well, I won't complain. I wouldn't complain if it didn't. But the entire premise about a popular vote is getting your supporters out to do just that, vote, and let the results be. Complaining is pointless, as there is really no concrete, verifiable evidence to back up claims of any type of fraud because is no concrete method open to the users that can substantiate or disprove any theory on how voting and rating occurs on this site (at least as far as I know).
Therefore, let's just let this thread end, and if you want to stem suspected means of defrauding this vote, talk to the MMORPG.com devs about solutions. A example would be to encourage them to limit accounts to one per IP address.
But let's let this thread end, get what supporters you wish to vote wth you, and vote. That's all that really matters really.
God Bless
Creed/PegasusJF
Seems you have missed it again Gameloading posted this so you can see it M8.
I didn't miss it and I did comment on it. You would have seen it if you actually read my posts before you comment on them.
Its on page 20 of this thread
having said that, I don't think CM's post has as much influence as CCP's, looking at the number of subscribers compared to EVE's. But its still something I think should not be done. I say mmorpg.com community should pick the awards. after all, its mmorpg.com's readers awards. Not CCP's/CM's.
READ my posts first before you comment on them, LordSlater.
Actually, I'm talking about the new reviews, and although very high, are still not better then WoW's.
Do you honnestly think the only reason WoW has so many subscribers is because of its advertisement? I live in Europe. there are no WoW tv ads, no WoW t-shirts. and you won't see a WoW commercial before you go to the cinema. even around christmas time, there are zero tv ads, the only thing I noticed were those free trial things in some stores. yet WoW europe has much more subscribers then EVE has worldwide, and when I visit gamespot.com or even microsoft.com, I keep noticing this EVE online advertisement. I will let you think about that one for a while.
They're called cookies, if you've been looking at anything related to EVE and go to one of those websites, the site will scan your cookies and try and present ads appropriate to what you have been looking at. You know, targetted advertising.
The newest reviews I've seen for WoW are 2004, 2 years ago....WHEN THE GAME CAME OUT!! If those same sites were to review WoW now, as I've said I doubt they would score it the same.
When you go into a game store do you see WoW boxes on the shelves? How about EVE? How many WoW boxes are there? 5? 10? A whole rack in the middle of the floor? Thats advertising for the game right there.
CCP don't care if they have millions of subscribers and neither does the playerbase. IT DOESN'T MAKE THE GAME BETTER. They bring in enough money to make a profit, spend several million a year on server upgrades, triple their staff and aquire White Wolf games. I'd say that means they're doing pretty damn good. And they didn't have to create a bland, generic game to do it.
Nobody here is denying that EVE is a good game that is doing very well, that is not the issue here.
Indeed, you do still see WoW boxes on the shelves. That is because WoW is still selling a lot every day, and EVE stopped selling years ago, hence it was taken off the shelves. if EVE was selling better, it would still be on the shelves today.
I don't share your opinion that WoW would receive worse ratings, because WoW didn't change. it added extra content, but it didn't change much, hence the review would be exactly the same as before.
I'm also pretty sure CCP DOES care about the amount of subscribers, its why they made a product in the first time. Subscriber base DOES point out how many people enjoy the game, and thats what games are all about
I got an EvE account, and I fell in love with the game. I do think it's better looking, for the most part, from most of it's counterparts. This is mainly because a game that deals with simple metallic textures and a lot of empty space for an environment doesn't really need the amount of work a game like WoW and FFO need to "look pretty." I'm an EvE fanboy, and I'll admit it. Mainly because the game allows you to play it how you want to play it. It's as complex or as simple as you want it to be.
Now, as far as the logistics of making a sticky post and putting it on the main page, et al...yeah, that's kind of cheap of CCP. What you do have to keep in mind is that CCP is not a major game studio, they don't have the money that Blizzard has to advertise on television, or the huge market pull that Blizzard has to put huge displays up at every game store there is. You can't get people to come to your game if they don't know about it, and this equates to free advertising for CCP.
A secondary affect is that most of the people who play EvE fall in love with it and cancel their other MMO accounts, at least that's been my experience. Those who don't do that typically don't really play the game very long. It's too complex for many casual gamers, it's definitely not for people who like playing dress-up with their elves, and there's no easy way to get really powerful really fast in EvE, and that's yet another reason I like the game. If you see a guy who's had an account for three years, he is going to turn you into a pile of mincemeat even if he's never particpated in PvE at all. Losing your shiny new ship in EvE that you just spent a month saving up for is a tragic loss, it hurts, and it's a serious setback for you and your character. As a result the game has a more visceral joy in PvP than most other games I've played, because you ARE scared. When you pop someone's ship you feel joy not in just winning the battle, but in surviving it.
Best game? I'm not sure, I haven't played them all, but I like it a lot more than the others I've played. Best PvP? From what I've heard from people on EvE who have played other games, it definitely has that.
What I do know is that it's a fine game and almost everyone who plays it absolutely loves it. I can't say the same for WoW, EQ, or UO players that I've known. Most of them have a serious love-hate relationship with their game. The only time I have a love-hate relationship with EvE is when I lose a battleship I forgot to buy insurance on
anything related to EVE and go to one of those websites, the site will
scan your cookies and try and present ads appropriate to what you have
been looking at. You know, targetted advertising.
The newest
reviews I've seen for WoW are 2004, 2 years ago....WHEN THE GAME CAME
OUT!! If those same sites were to review WoW now, as I've said I doubt
they would score it the same.
When you go into a game
store do you see WoW boxes on the shelves? How about EVE? How many WoW
boxes are there? 5? 10? A whole rack in the middle of the floor? Thats
advertising for the game right there.
CCP don't care if they
have millions of subscribers and neither does the playerbase. IT
DOESN'T MAKE THE GAME BETTER. They bring in enough money to make a
profit, spend several million a year on server upgrades, triple their
staff and aquire White Wolf games. I'd say that means they're doing
pretty damn good. And they didn't have to create a bland, generic game
to do it.
Nobody here is denying that EVE is a good game that is doing very well, that is not the issue here.
Indeed,
you do still see WoW boxes on the shelves. That is because WoW is still
selling a lot every day, and EVE stopped selling years ago, hence it
was taken off the shelves. if EVE was selling better, it would still be
on the shelves today.
I don't share your opinion that WoW would
receive worse ratings, because WoW didn't change. it added extra
content, but it didn't change much, hence the review would be exactly
the same as before.
I'm also pretty sure CCP DOES care about
the amount of subscribers, its why they made a product in the first
time. Subscriber base DOES point out how many people enjoy the game,
and thats what games are all about
EVE is
not on store shelves because Simon & Schuster Interactive, the
games original publisher closed down, after that CCP decided not to
sign up with another publisher. I believe there was only about 100,000
or so boxed games ever made for EVE, of which a few thousand are still
floating around. They have had the option to release a new boxes on
shelves when they brought out a new expansion but they CHOSE not to.
They have had buyout offers from all the major publishers (EA, Vivendi,
Ubisoft, etc) but CHOSE not to sell out and lose control of their game.
WoW has added a bunch of 40 man raids to the game, something that is
hated by all but about 15% of their playerbase, they've added PVP BG,
another addition that is almost universally reviled by it's playerbase
due to the rediculous grinds they require. Do you honestly think that a
reviewer who had played the first 20-30 levels of the game is going to
have the same opinion after hitting the endgame grind, or the PVP
grind? I sure don't.
CCP always new they would never have a huge subscriber base, actually
they are surprised it passed 100K and continues to grow so quickly.
They set out to create a living breathing virtual universe where
players could build their own empires. At that they've succeeded
greatly.
I don't know about you but I don't hold the reader's choice awards or ratings from a site that is so easy to create a 2nd, 3rd or 50th account in high regard. Neither do the major game companies or this site wouldn't need ad sales from gold farmer's to pay their bills.
I sleep with a pillow under my gun.
Seems you have missed it again Gameloading posted this so you can see it M8.
I didn't miss it and I did comment on it. You would have seen it if you actually read my posts before you comment on them.
Its on page 20 of this thread
having said that, I don't think CM's post has as much influence as CCP's, looking at the number of subscribers compared to EVE's. But its still something I think should not be done. I say mmorpg.com community should pick the awards. after all, its mmorpg.com's readers awards. Not CCP's/CM's.
READ my posts first before you comment on them, LordSlater.
Sorry so amny bad posts here ive stopped reading them all.