Heh ... an AoC developer - a game that is now officially just glorified adware - takes makes cheap shots at a proper game.
A proper game actually makes its way into stores. Enough said there.
Call me when AoC actually makes it into stores. With the release date getting pushed back all the time I'm starting to think it's just vapourware.
Unbelievable...
This is the state of Darkfall fans. Is there something wrong with you? Or do you just enjoy acting like a moron? I realize that the Internet allows idiots to hide behind their real identity, but come on. Give me a break.
Can't you simply make a "valid" argument for your cherished game?
Thinking AOC will be an excellent title is NOT the point. The point is simply this. AOC is an "actual" game, like or not. It has been played by thousands of people, like it or not. It has been previewed by dozens of professional gaming magazines and Internet sites, like it or not. It is ACTUALLY releasing on May 20, 2008. People have pre-ordered this title, like it or not.
In simple words for obvious simple minds... AOC actually exists !!!
No one has ever actually played Darkfall nor seen it. Please don't give me the Asp story, it's neither credible or believable. In fact... There is NO proof whatsoever that an actual working alpha build of Darkfall has ever been made.
But you and the others can continue in your little dream worlds, till Hell freezes over if you like. We can rehash this post next year at this time.
I can't wait to hear the new excuses.
I agree with everything you said except one point. Asp has flown to Greece and has played the game. (so the story goes since he has pictures of office that looks like very temporary office space... i.e. nothing at all on the walls except a single Darkfall Online poster and a coat rack.)
How does having some pictures of a ratty office space with a poster for the game turn into him being in greece and playing it? You sure he wasn't in Macon Georgia hanging out with his buddies who printed out a poster for darkfall?
The sleeper awakes...and rides his dirtbike to the mall.
Wondered abit why Tasos were so on the offence in last Developer Journal towards (as i read it )especially the game Age of Conan and its develpers Funcom. This might be one of the reasons behind all the turbulance. A thread from the Age of Conan website. Some cheap shots from a Age of Conan developer. http://forums.ageofconan.com/showthread.php?t=19320&page=3 In this thread you can read about statements like this from Developer Athelan. [QUOTE] Athelan- developer of Age of Conan:
Pre-Order now for the low low price of only 6 payments of 99.99 and we will throw in this brand new kitchen sink for free, AND WAIT THATS NOT ALL get this complete box set of ABBA's greatest hits!... AND WE MUST BEEEE CRAAAAZZZZYY BECAUSE NOT ONLY ARE WE GOING TO GIVE YOU THAT BUT I AM GOING TO GIVE YOU THE COMBO JUICER SUPER SQUIEGEE HIGH POWER WASHING FULLY CARBIDE KITCHEN KUNG FU IRON CHEF KNIFE SET! BUY NOW!
Thats what that video makes me think of.
I mean if the game comes out with 1/10th of what is claimed there. If it only delivered on skill based, open pvp that was fun. I would check it out at least. But anytime I see claims like that I just can't take it serious. But thats a fan movie so hopefully they are not promising all that. [/QUOTE] Another one from same developer and same thread- [QUOTE] Athelan- developer of Age of Conan: Dont they have like infinite time and money now thanks to some rich sheik's son from the middle east?[/QUOTE] And the last one i found in same thread- [QUOTE] Athelan- developer of Age of Conan: Well there is a big difference between making some promises and not being able to deliver everything, and literally promising everything :P
It's like saying I promise to buy you a new car by the end of the year. At the end of the year I didn't buy you a brand new BMW I ended up buying a Honda.
But if I promised to buy you a Ferrari, and said no not just a Ferrari but a Ferrari Enzo, with custom solid gold rims, and full leather interior custom made out of lambskin. Then delivered you a used 1983 Mazda, or a toy car looking like a Ferrari ;p. [/QUOTE] This kind of behaviour is really tasteless and is hitting below the belt. No wonder Tasos gave some pounches to Funcom after reading this. And Tasos own responce to this turbulance can be read in thread link below on the Darkfall board and its way more mature then the represant from Funcom outburst on Darkfall developers and their game. http://forums.darkfallonline.com/showthread.php?t=32653 [QUOTE]Tasos Flambouras- Darkfall Developer : You'll never catch Darkfall developers taking cheap shots against other MMOs. Aside from adhering to professional courtesy standards, we're not that concerned about them to bother. You shouldn't be either.
I'll lock this thread now if that's alright.[/QUOTE]
How come you haven't posted a new post regarding the fact that your Golden boy Tasos fired back with equally unprofessional behavior? Why is it ok for Adventurine and not for Funcom? Why the bias?
The sleeper awakes...and rides his dirtbike to the mall.
Am I the only one that really doesn't care which game is the best? When Darkfall comes out, I'll buy it and play, the same thing with AoC, WAR, TCoS, etc... I like MMOs and if a game is satisfying and fun, I'll buy it. What the developer for AoC said about Darkfall, is it a lie?
/quoted for the best response ever
I will buy and try most every MMO that comes out. I am a fan of the genre, and as such I like to be up to date on the best games for me.
You are the winner!
The sleeper awakes...and rides his dirtbike to the mall.
Wondered abit why Tasos were so on the offence in last Developer Journal towards (as i read it )especially the game Age of Conan and its develpers Funcom. This might be one of the reasons behind all the turbulance. A thread from the Age of Conan website. Some cheap shots from a Age of Conan developer. http://forums.ageofconan.com/showthread.php?t=19320&page=3 In this thread you can read about statements like this from Developer Athelan. [QUOTE] Athelan- developer of Age of Conan:
Pre-Order now for the low low price of only 6 payments of 99.99 and we will throw in this brand new kitchen sink for free, AND WAIT THATS NOT ALL get this complete box set of ABBA's greatest hits!... AND WE MUST BEEEE CRAAAAZZZZYY BECAUSE NOT ONLY ARE WE GOING TO GIVE YOU THAT BUT I AM GOING TO GIVE YOU THE COMBO JUICER SUPER SQUIEGEE HIGH POWER WASHING FULLY CARBIDE KITCHEN KUNG FU IRON CHEF KNIFE SET! BUY NOW!
Thats what that video makes me think of.
I mean if the game comes out with 1/10th of what is claimed there. If it only delivered on skill based, open pvp that was fun. I would check it out at least. But anytime I see claims like that I just can't take it serious. But thats a fan movie so hopefully they are not promising all that. [/QUOTE] Another one from same developer and same thread- [QUOTE] Athelan- developer of Age of Conan: Dont they have like infinite time and money now thanks to some rich sheik's son from the middle east?[/QUOTE] And the last one i found in same thread- [QUOTE] Athelan- developer of Age of Conan: Well there is a big difference between making some promises and not being able to deliver everything, and literally promising everything :P
It's like saying I promise to buy you a new car by the end of the year. At the end of the year I didn't buy you a brand new BMW I ended up buying a Honda.
But if I promised to buy you a Ferrari, and said no not just a Ferrari but a Ferrari Enzo, with custom solid gold rims, and full leather interior custom made out of lambskin. Then delivered you a used 1983 Mazda, or a toy car looking like a Ferrari ;p. [/QUOTE] This kind of behaviour is really tasteless and is hitting below the belt. No wonder Tasos gave some pounches to Funcom after reading this. And Tasos own responce to this turbulance can be read in thread link below on the Darkfall board and its way more mature then the represant from Funcom outburst on Darkfall developers and their game. http://forums.darkfallonline.com/showthread.php?t=32653 [QUOTE]Tasos Flambouras- Darkfall Developer : You'll never catch Darkfall developers taking cheap shots against other MMOs. Aside from adhering to professional courtesy standards, we're not that concerned about them to bother. You shouldn't be either.
I'll lock this thread now if that's alright.[/QUOTE]
How come you haven't posted a new post regarding the fact that your Golden boy Tasos fired back with equally unprofessional behavior? Why is it ok for Adventurine and not for Funcom? Why the bias?
he never said any game name.
but we all know what game hes talking about plus he nerver really fired back he just mention what they did lol.
With the lack of information about this game coming out any time soon. i would say he can talk all he wants. The proof is always in the pudding people. You have to show to prove!
Wondered abit why Tasos were so on the offence in last Developer Journal towards (as i read it )especially the game Age of Conan and its develpers Funcom. This might be one of the reasons behind all the turbulance. A thread from the Age of Conan website. Some cheap shots from a Age of Conan developer. http://forums.ageofconan.com/showthread.php?t=19320&page=3 In this thread you can read about statements like this from Developer Athelan. [QUOTE] Athelan- developer of Age of Conan:
Pre-Order now for the low low price of only 6 payments of 99.99 and we will throw in this brand new kitchen sink for free, AND WAIT THATS NOT ALL get this complete box set of ABBA's greatest hits!... AND WE MUST BEEEE CRAAAAZZZZYY BECAUSE NOT ONLY ARE WE GOING TO GIVE YOU THAT BUT I AM GOING TO GIVE YOU THE COMBO JUICER SUPER SQUIEGEE HIGH POWER WASHING FULLY CARBIDE KITCHEN KUNG FU IRON CHEF KNIFE SET! BUY NOW!
Thats what that video makes me think of.
I mean if the game comes out with 1/10th of what is claimed there. If it only delivered on skill based, open pvp that was fun. I would check it out at least. But anytime I see claims like that I just can't take it serious. But thats a fan movie so hopefully they are not promising all that. [/QUOTE] Another one from same developer and same thread- [QUOTE] Athelan- developer of Age of Conan: Dont they have like infinite time and money now thanks to some rich sheik's son from the middle east?[/QUOTE] And the last one i found in same thread- [QUOTE] Athelan- developer of Age of Conan: Well there is a big difference between making some promises and not being able to deliver everything, and literally promising everything :P
It's like saying I promise to buy you a new car by the end of the year. At the end of the year I didn't buy you a brand new BMW I ended up buying a Honda.
But if I promised to buy you a Ferrari, and said no not just a Ferrari but a Ferrari Enzo, with custom solid gold rims, and full leather interior custom made out of lambskin. Then delivered you a used 1983 Mazda, or a toy car looking like a Ferrari ;p. [/QUOTE] This kind of behaviour is really tasteless and is hitting below the belt. No wonder Tasos gave some pounches to Funcom after reading this. And Tasos own responce to this turbulance can be read in thread link below on the Darkfall board and its way more mature then the represant from Funcom outburst on Darkfall developers and their game. http://forums.darkfallonline.com/showthread.php?t=32653 [QUOTE]Tasos Flambouras- Darkfall Developer : You'll never catch Darkfall developers taking cheap shots against other MMOs. Aside from adhering to professional courtesy standards, we're not that concerned about them to bother. You shouldn't be either.
I'll lock this thread now if that's alright.[/QUOTE]
How come you haven't posted a new post regarding the fact that your Golden boy Tasos fired back with equally unprofessional behavior? Why is it ok for Adventurine and not for Funcom? Why the bias?
he never said any game name.
but we all know what game hes talking about plus he nerver really fired back he just mention what they did lol.
what funcom did was make up a lie
You are very right, he didn't say any specific game so you know what his comments actually mean? Nothing. For example "The world is 8 times larger than the largest mmo or soon to release mmo" For all we know that don't mean jack. What's he using for comparison?
Anyway, I'm curious what lie did the AoC developer make up?
You are very right, he didn't say any specific game so you know what his comments actually mean? Nothing. For example "The world is 8 times larger than the largest mmo or soon to release mmo" For all we know that don't mean jack. What's he using for comparison?
Anyway, I'm curious what lie did the AoC developer make up?
The dev made a statement based on uncertain terms. He says DF will not be able to deliver on their promises. The fact is that this dev doesn't know anything about what state DF is in nor if it can deliver or not.
He should have taken the high road and not commented on something he doesn't know anyting about.
--- And when we got more women on the team, it was like No, no, no. We need puppies and horses in there. John Smedley, SOE
You are very right, he didn't say any specific game so you know what his comments actually mean? Nothing. For example "The world is 8 times larger than the largest mmo or soon to release mmo" For all we know that don't mean jack. What's he using for comparison?
Anyway, I'm curious what lie did the AoC developer make up?
The dev made a statement based on uncertain terms. He says DF will not be able to deliver on their promises. The fact is that this dev doesn't know anything about what state DF is in nor if it can deliver or not.
He should have taken the high road and not commented on something he doesn't know anyting about.
Sigh..no, its known as making an opinion about the feasibility of an activity based on your past experience and professional knowledge.
I'm not a scientist, yet I'm pretty sure I can make a statement that given the technology of the near future, it is not possible to build a faster than light drive.
Someone comes along and says they're building one, and I'm going to be scathingly a skeptic until the day comes that they prove they've got a working model.
DF Dev's are in the same position. They've made claims to deliver the most feature laden MMORPG game in history, all the while defying all normal programming/marketing/funding conventions. Of course no one in the industry is going to believe them.
The good news is, that "experts" are frequently proven wrong time and again in history.
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
You are very right, he didn't say any specific game so you know what his comments actually mean? Nothing. For example "The world is 8 times larger than the largest mmo or soon to release mmo" For all we know that don't mean jack. What's he using for comparison?
Anyway, I'm curious what lie did the AoC developer make up?
The dev made a statement based on uncertain terms. He says DF will not be able to deliver on their promises. The fact is that this dev doesn't know anything about what state DF is in nor if it can deliver or not.
He should have taken the high road and not commented on something he doesn't know anyting about.
The dev was stating his opinion of a fan movie, how it made him feel watching it and what were some of the things that came to mind as he watched it. How is that taking a cheap shot at the devs of DF? Considering this is a moot point anyway as the comments were made over a year ago, I still don't see how they justify the way Tasos carried on in his last interview.
Sigh..no, its known as making an opinion about the feasibility of an activity based on your past experience and professional knowledge. I'm not a scientist, yet I'm pretty sure I can make a statement that given the technology of the near future, it is not possible to build a faster than light drive. Someone comes along and says they're building one, and I'm going to be scathingly a skeptic until the day comes that they prove they've got a working model. DF Dev's are in the same position. They've made claims to deliver the most feature laden MMORPG game in history, all the while defying all normal programming/marketing/funding conventions. Of course no one in the industry is going to believe them. The good news is, that "experts" are frequently proven wrong time and again in history. But that's not the way to bet.
There are opinions and there are marketing tricks trying to make the competition look silly.
Comparing the features in DF to "faster than light" technology is a huge overstatement imo. There is isn't anything impossible at all with the features but you do need to do sacrifices (like graphics vs loadtimes).
--- And when we got more women on the team, it was like No, no, no. We need puppies and horses in there. John Smedley, SOE
The dev was stating his opinion of a fan movie, how it made him feel watching it and what were some of the things that came to mind as he watched it. How is that taking a cheap shot at the devs of DF? Considering this is a moot point anyway as the comments were made over a year ago, I still don't see how they justify the way Tasos carried on in his last interview.
No game was mentioned but since everyone "know" what game they refer to, perchance there are some truth in it ? Even based on facts, something the devs of AoC doesn't need to have to form an opinion.
--- And when we got more women on the team, it was like No, no, no. We need puppies and horses in there. John Smedley, SOE
There are opinions and there are marketing tricks trying to make the competition look silly. Comparing the features in DF to "faster than light" technology is a huge overstatement imo. There is isn't anything impossible at all with the features but you do need to do sacrifices (like graphics vs loadtimes).
So you have programmed a game then? Perhaps you have been involved in one of the major MMO games created? Maybe you built a browser game....in the very least? No? You haven't?
Then it would seem you've absolutely no leg to stand on when deciding what is or is not a fair comparison. Nor, would it seem, do you have the appropriate experience to properly classify whether or not any comment made had any basis in fact. There ARE limitiations...and no, using junk GFX does not somehow magically enable you to do things others cannot. Some of the most basic limitations to the genre have nothing to do with graphical resources at all...they deal with the most basic structure of current internet line loads. They deal with basic marketing, and intelligent business. They deal with the most fundamental issues with core PC hardware. Most of all, some limitations are purely based on having tons of money, and tons of workers in order to make a game in sufficient time so that you can release before the system and concept are ages old and stagnate.
Fact here is, you know nothing about anything. If a rocket scientist walks up to you and states that you cannot build a craft to fly you to mars...you just assume he knows more about it than you. The AoC guy does this stuff for a living...and does with with a LARGE team of people who are probably even twice as qualified as anyone on this indie team. If they say, "Takes too much" then I'm inclined to at LEAST believe that such an endeavor would, in the very least, require a FAR larger team and much higher finances than Adventurine has currently been operating with.
I have no trouble believing that it COULD be done. But a handful of guys (less than SOE has keeping SWG alfoat) can somehow make this magical holy grail for you. If the game hits beta...you can BET hard money it won't be anything near what your expectations are. Moving on to the BIG issue I have......
This game has been "near beta" so many times now its sickening. Now, I'm DONE debating how badly this looks....because such a debate detracts from the real point to take from this. Not one single game, free...indie...or AAA, EVER released has ever had this little info about their game once it was "near beta". IN fact....these guys use every last free resource they can find to showcase SOMETHING about the game to make sure players have an ideal about their product and how well it will hold up. Adventurine DOES NOT. They don't even have comparable information about their game to what most companies have when their game leaves internal testing. Hell, Blizzard had more information up when the game was still in concept form. These guys have felt their games was "near beta" for several years now. Near beta means the game is practically COMPLETE. As in, all key elements are IN place and have been past internal testing which ensures that the game will function once installed.
By every measure we possibly have to go by when viewing the hard facts about this....DF isn't even finished with internal testing. They have less gameplay showcased than some have even after internal. For us to assume the game is near beta....we must also then accept that this company doesn't WANT to show you anything solid about it. There are deliberately, and without reason, hiding their "holy grail" just to spite you. Either that, or there are SERIOUS problems and they do not want to showcase it. This would allow them time while they forced on ahead into beta to try and kill two birds with one stone. This concept is terrible.
There are worse things too....other horrible plots they COULD be working with that delve even further down this rabbit hole of screwing their fans.
So you have programmed a game then? Perhaps you have been involved in one of the major MMO games created? Maybe you built a browser game....in the very least? No? You haven't?
Then it would seem you've absolutely no leg to stand on when deciding what is or is not a fair comparison. Nor, would it seem, do you have the appropriate experience to properly classify whether or not any comment made had any basis in fact. There ARE limitiations...and no, using junk GFX does not somehow magically enable you to do things others cannot. Some of the most basic limitations to the genre have nothing to do with graphical resources at all...they deal with the most basic structure of current internet line loads. They deal with basic marketing, and intelligent business. They deal with the most fundamental issues with core PC hardware. Most of all, some limitations are purely based on having tons of money, and tons of workers in order to make a game in sufficient time so that you can release before the system and concept are ages old and stagnate.
Fact here is, you know nothing about anything. If a rocket scientist walks up to you and states that you cannot build a craft to fly you to mars...you just assume he knows more about it than you. The AoC guy does this stuff for a living...and does with with a LARGE team of people who are probably even twice as qualified as anyone on this indie team. If they say, "Takes too much" then I'm inclined to at LEAST believe that such an endeavor would, in the very least, require a FAR larger team and much higher finances than Adventurine has currently been operating with. I have no trouble believing that it COULD be done. But a handful of guys (less than SOE has keeping SWG alfoat) can somehow make this magical holy grail for you. If the game hits beta...you can BET hard money it won't be anything near what your expectations are. Moving on to the BIG issue I have......
This game has been "near beta" so many times now its sickening. Now, I'm DONE debating how badly this looks....because such a debate detracts from the real point to take from this. Not one single game, free...indie...or AAA, EVER released has ever had this little info about their game once it was "near beta". IN fact....these guys use every last free resource they can find to showcase SOMETHING about the game to make sure players have an ideal about their product and how well it will hold up. Adventurine DOES NOT. They don't even have comparable information about their game to what most companies have when their game leaves internal testing. Hell, Blizzard had more information up when the game was still in concept form. These guys have felt their games was "near beta" for several years now. Near beta means the game is practically COMPLETE. As in, all key elements are IN place and have been past internal testing which ensures that the game will function once installed. By every measure we possibly have to go by when viewing the hard facts about this....DF isn't even finished with internal testing. They have less gameplay showcased than some have even after internal. For us to assume the game is near beta....we must also then accept that this company doesn't WANT to show you anything solid about it. There are deliberately, and without reason, hiding their "holy grail" just to spite you. Either that, or there are SERIOUS problems and they do not want to showcase it. This would allow them time while they forced on ahead into beta to try and kill two birds with one stone. This concept is terrible. There are worse things too....other horrible plots they COULD be working with that delve even further down this rabbit hole of screwing their fans.
The only fact here is that neither of us know what is possible or not. If Aventurine claims to be able to something and they are not, they and not us as consumers is going to get screwed. Why ? Because I will be able to test the game and see for myself before any money will change hands. If I don't like what I see, I will not buy. With a businessmodel like that, how on this earth will it be possible to get screwed ?
--- And when we got more women on the team, it was like No, no, no. We need puppies and horses in there. John Smedley, SOE
With the lack of information about this game coming out any time soon. i would say he can talk all he wants. The proof is always in the pudding people. You have to show to prove!
Darkfall isn't even in beta yet, so it might be one reason for the lack of information?
______________________________ The Sceptics, yes they're special but we've need them to.. I guess. And if they're put more effort MMORPG.com can create a 'Team Sceptic' and send them to the Special Olympus.
Yea how much info did oyu get before AOc or anyother game was in beta?
That has ZERO to do with this game. The devs themselves have said they almost released 2x already but didn't get the publishing deal they wanted. That being said, this game is supposedly ready. That means we should have all the information we need. That means that if they are still working on it, it should be nothing but polish at this time. Yet we get no beta and very sketchy information. Wonder why that is?
The reason for the serious lack of information is because "they got na'TING" as Sgt Shultz would say.
Fear not fanbois, we are not trolls, let's take off your tin foil hat and learn what VAPORWARE is:
"Vaporware is a term used to describe a software or hardware product that is announced by a developer well in advance of release, but which then fails to emerge after having well exceeded the period of development time that was initially claimed or would normally be expected for the development cycle of a similar product."
Because they dont have apr departmeant and ig uess the devs have said they arent going to give of or shows us everything because they want us to find it for are selfs when we play it.. but hey you dont belive them so meh. I guess we will find out if there full of it wont we.
Yea how much info did oyu get before AOc or anyother game was in beta?
That has ZERO to do with this game. The devs themselves have said they almost released 2x already but didn't get the publishing deal they wanted. That being said, this game is supposedly ready. That means we should have all the information we need. That means that if they are still working on it, it should be nothing but polish at this time. Yet we get no beta and very sketchy information. Wonder why that is?
The reason for the serious lack of information is because "they got na'TING" as Sgt Shultz would say.
So you say that other games wasn't close to be done when they're were closed to beta/release? Or do you mean that they sould go out with all information about everything before beta? Or was all this drivel just so you should look smart when you wrote the last sentence? Please elaborate.
______________________________ The Sceptics, yes they're special but we've need them to.. I guess. And if they're put more effort MMORPG.com can create a 'Team Sceptic' and send them to the Special Olympus.
Yea how much info did oyu get before AOc or anyother game was in beta?
That has ZERO to do with this game. The devs themselves have said they almost released 2x already but didn't get the publishing deal they wanted. That being said, this game is supposedly ready. That means we should have all the information we need. That means that if they are still working on it, it should be nothing but polish at this time. Yet we get no beta and very sketchy information. Wonder why that is?
The reason for the serious lack of information is because "they got na'TING" as Sgt Shultz would say.
So you say that other games wasn't close to be done when they're were closed to beta/release? Or do you mean that they sould go out with all information about everything before beta? Or was all this drivel just so you should look smart when you wrote the last sentence? Please elaborate.
I thought it was pretty self explanatory:
AoC devs: Games not ready, needs more polish, we're delaying.
Darkfall devs: Darkfall is ready now. We just need a publisher.....again.
Darkfall is always "ready for beta" and "just needing a publisher".
Sorry, you don't have this bad a time finding a publisher if your game is "ready". If the game is as "good" as you all think it is, and as "ready" as they continually claim it is, a smart publisher would agree to concessions from the devs, since they'd see the market potential. So far, none of them have seen it, I guess.
AoC devs: Games not ready, needs more polish, we're delaying. Darkfall devs: Darkfall is ready now. We just need a publisher.....again. Darkfall is always "ready for beta" and "just needing a publisher". Sorry, you don't have this bad a time finding a publisher if your game is "ready". If the game is as "good" as you all think it is, and as "ready" as they continually claim it is, a smart publisher would agree to concessions from the devs, since they'd see the market potential. So far, none of them have seen it, I guess.
It's not only polish that delay AoC. remember the control thing ? They actually needed 4 years to undetstand that their controls where too tricky for the gamers. That is not polish, that is redisign that cost a 6(?) month delay. Funcom seem to be good at finding reasons for delaying their release.
I'm curious to what obvious market potential you are talking about ? It's not about smart or not, it's about the risk you are willing to take. If the potential is so great, how come 1 in 10 mmos out there are level based themepark games ? If it is new, the risk is greater. A great risk require a bigger piece of the income. If Aventurine, isn't willing to give them that, you have a problem agreeing on a deal. I don't know what is the truth here but it is an realistic alternative to "they have no publishers because the game is vaporware and/or suck".
--- And when we got more women on the team, it was like No, no, no. We need puppies and horses in there. John Smedley, SOE
Yea how much info did oyu get before AOc or anyother game was in beta?
That has ZERO to do with this game. The devs themselves have said they almost released 2x already but didn't get the publishing deal they wanted. That being said, this game is supposedly ready. That means we should have all the information we need. That means that if they are still working on it, it should be nothing but polish at this time. Yet we get no beta and very sketchy information. Wonder why that is?
The reason for the serious lack of information is because "they got na'TING" as Sgt Shultz would say.
So you say that other games wasn't close to be done when they're were closed to beta/release? Or do you mean that they sould go out with all information about everything before beta? Or was all this drivel just so you should look smart when you wrote the last sentence? Please elaborate.
Personally i think she tried to look smart. Anybody else?
Yea how much info did oyu get before AOc or anyother game was in beta?
That has ZERO to do with this game. The devs themselves have said they almost released 2x already but didn't get the publishing deal they wanted. That being said, this game is supposedly ready. That means we should have all the information we need. That means that if they are still working on it, it should be nothing but polish at this time. Yet we get no beta and very sketchy information. Wonder why that is?
The reason for the serious lack of information is because "they got na'TING" as Sgt Shultz would say.
So you say that other games wasn't close to be done when they're were closed to beta/release? Or do you mean that they sould go out with all information about everything before beta? Or was all this drivel just so you should look smart when you wrote the last sentence? Please elaborate.
I thought it was pretty self explanatory:
AoC devs: Games not ready, needs more polish, we're delaying.
Darkfall devs: Darkfall is ready now. We just need a publisher.....again.
Darkfall is always "ready for beta" and "just needing a publisher".
Sorry, you don't have this bad a time finding a publisher if your game is "ready". If the game is as "good" as you all think it is, and as "ready" as they continually claim it is, a smart publisher would agree to concessions from the devs, since they'd see the market potential. So far, none of them have seen it, I guess.
[QUOTE] Tasos Flambouras :Our progress with publishers is steady, unfortunately everyone moves at their own speed. Unless something unexpected happens, we are self-publishing in at least one territory so we've been working on that and using our time constructively to that end. [/QUOTE]
Yea how much info did oyu get before AOc or anyother game was in beta?
That has ZERO to do with this game. The devs themselves have said they almost released 2x already but didn't get the publishing deal they wanted. That being said, this game is supposedly ready. That means we should have all the information we need. That means that if they are still working on it, it should be nothing but polish at this time. Yet we get no beta and very sketchy information. Wonder why that is?
The reason for the serious lack of information is because "they got na'TING" as Sgt Shultz would say.
So you say that other games wasn't close to be done when they're were closed to beta/release? Or do you mean that they sould go out with all information about everything before beta? Or was all this drivel just so you should look smart when you wrote the last sentence? Please elaborate.
Personally i think she tried to look smart. Anybody else?
Shannia makes a totally valid point: either (a) the game is, as Aventurine claims, "ready to go except for a bit of final polish", in which case there would be NO good reason not to show a working model of DF in Beta, or at a gaming convention, or *somewhere*,
OR
(b) the game is not as ready as Aventurine claims, in which case they are lying.
Pretty obvious really, to (almost) everyone. Full credit to downtoearth, Aragon100 and Seggallion though for valiantly managing to draw out this non-debate for so many pages. Hoping you'll be the next "mystery guests" to be invited to Greece for a sniff around their internal testing labs, eh boys? Wouldn't hold your breath...
Comments
A proper game actually makes its way into stores. Enough said there.
Call me when AoC actually makes it into stores. With the release date getting pushed back all the time I'm starting to think it's just vapourware.
Unbelievable...
This is the state of Darkfall fans. Is there something wrong with you? Or do you just enjoy acting like a moron? I realize that the Internet allows idiots to hide behind their real identity, but come on. Give me a break.
Can't you simply make a "valid" argument for your cherished game?
Thinking AOC will be an excellent title is NOT the point. The point is simply this. AOC is an "actual" game, like or not. It has been played by thousands of people, like it or not. It has been previewed by dozens of professional gaming magazines and Internet sites, like it or not. It is ACTUALLY releasing on May 20, 2008. People have pre-ordered this title, like it or not.
In simple words for obvious simple minds... AOC actually exists !!!
No one has ever actually played Darkfall nor seen it. Please don't give me the Asp story, it's neither credible or believable. In fact... There is NO proof whatsoever that an actual working alpha build of Darkfall has ever been made.
But you and the others can continue in your little dream worlds, till Hell freezes over if you like. We can rehash this post next year at this time.
I can't wait to hear the new excuses.
I agree with everything you said except one point. Asp has flown to Greece and has played the game. (so the story goes since he has pictures of office that looks like very temporary office space... i.e. nothing at all on the walls except a single Darkfall Online poster and a coat rack.)
How does having some pictures of a ratty office space with a poster for the game turn into him being in greece and playing it? You sure he wasn't in Macon Georgia hanging out with his buddies who printed out a poster for darkfall?
The sleeper awakes...and rides his dirtbike to the mall.
Am I the only one that really doesn't care which game is the best?
When Darkfall comes out, I'll buy it and play, the same thing with AoC, WAR, TCoS, etc...
I like MMOs and if a game is satisfying and fun, I'll buy it.
What the developer for AoC said about Darkfall, is it a lie?
How come you haven't posted a new post regarding the fact that your Golden boy Tasos fired back with equally unprofessional behavior? Why is it ok for Adventurine and not for Funcom? Why the bias?
The sleeper awakes...and rides his dirtbike to the mall.
I will buy and try most every MMO that comes out. I am a fan of the genre, and as such I like to be up to date on the best games for me.
You are the winner!
The sleeper awakes...and rides his dirtbike to the mall.
How come you haven't posted a new post regarding the fact that your Golden boy Tasos fired back with equally unprofessional behavior? Why is it ok for Adventurine and not for Funcom? Why the bias?
he never said any game name.but we all know what game hes talking about plus he nerver really fired back he just mention what they did lol.
what funcom did was make up a lie
With the lack of information about this game coming out any time soon. i would say he can talk all he wants. The proof is always in the pudding people. You have to show to prove!
How come you haven't posted a new post regarding the fact that your Golden boy Tasos fired back with equally unprofessional behavior? Why is it ok for Adventurine and not for Funcom? Why the bias?
he never said any game name.but we all know what game hes talking about plus he nerver really fired back he just mention what they did lol.
what funcom did was make up a lie
You are very right, he didn't say any specific game so you know what his comments actually mean? Nothing. For example "The world is 8 times larger than the largest mmo or soon to release mmo" For all we know that don't mean jack. What's he using for comparison?Anyway, I'm curious what lie did the AoC developer make up?
The dev made a statement based on uncertain terms. He says DF will not be able to deliver on their promises. The fact is that this dev doesn't know anything about what state DF is in nor if it can deliver or not.
He should have taken the high road and not commented on something he doesn't know anyting about.
---
And when we got more women on the team, it was like No, no, no. We need puppies and horses in there.
John Smedley, SOE
The dev made a statement based on uncertain terms. He says DF will not be able to deliver on their promises. The fact is that this dev doesn't know anything about what state DF is in nor if it can deliver or not.
He should have taken the high road and not commented on something he doesn't know anyting about.
Sigh..no, its known as making an opinion about the feasibility of an activity based on your past experience and professional knowledge.
I'm not a scientist, yet I'm pretty sure I can make a statement that given the technology of the near future, it is not possible to build a faster than light drive.
Someone comes along and says they're building one, and I'm going to be scathingly a skeptic until the day comes that they prove they've got a working model.
DF Dev's are in the same position. They've made claims to deliver the most feature laden MMORPG game in history, all the while defying all normal programming/marketing/funding conventions. Of course no one in the industry is going to believe them.
The good news is, that "experts" are frequently proven wrong time and again in history.
But that's not the way to bet.
"True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde
"I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
The dev made a statement based on uncertain terms. He says DF will not be able to deliver on their promises. The fact is that this dev doesn't know anything about what state DF is in nor if it can deliver or not.
He should have taken the high road and not commented on something he doesn't know anyting about.
The dev was stating his opinion of a fan movie, how it made him feel watching it and what were some of the things that came to mind as he watched it. How is that taking a cheap shot at the devs of DF? Considering this is a moot point anyway as the comments were made over a year ago, I still don't see how they justify the way Tasos carried on in his last interview.
There are opinions and there are marketing tricks trying to make the competition look silly.
Comparing the features in DF to "faster than light" technology is a huge overstatement imo. There is isn't anything impossible at all with the features but you do need to do sacrifices (like graphics vs loadtimes).
---
And when we got more women on the team, it was like No, no, no. We need puppies and horses in there.
John Smedley, SOE
No game was mentioned but since everyone "know" what game they refer to, perchance there are some truth in it ? Even based on facts, something the devs of AoC doesn't need to have to form an opinion.
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And when we got more women on the team, it was like No, no, no. We need puppies and horses in there.
John Smedley, SOE
So you have programmed a game then? Perhaps you have been involved in one of the major MMO games created? Maybe you built a browser game....in the very least? No? You haven't?
Then it would seem you've absolutely no leg to stand on when deciding what is or is not a fair comparison. Nor, would it seem, do you have the appropriate experience to properly classify whether or not any comment made had any basis in fact. There ARE limitiations...and no, using junk GFX does not somehow magically enable you to do things others cannot. Some of the most basic limitations to the genre have nothing to do with graphical resources at all...they deal with the most basic structure of current internet line loads. They deal with basic marketing, and intelligent business. They deal with the most fundamental issues with core PC hardware. Most of all, some limitations are purely based on having tons of money, and tons of workers in order to make a game in sufficient time so that you can release before the system and concept are ages old and stagnate.
Fact here is, you know nothing about anything. If a rocket scientist walks up to you and states that you cannot build a craft to fly you to mars...you just assume he knows more about it than you. The AoC guy does this stuff for a living...and does with with a LARGE team of people who are probably even twice as qualified as anyone on this indie team. If they say, "Takes too much" then I'm inclined to at LEAST believe that such an endeavor would, in the very least, require a FAR larger team and much higher finances than Adventurine has currently been operating with.
I have no trouble believing that it COULD be done. But a handful of guys (less than SOE has keeping SWG alfoat) can somehow make this magical holy grail for you. If the game hits beta...you can BET hard money it won't be anything near what your expectations are. Moving on to the BIG issue I have......
This game has been "near beta" so many times now its sickening. Now, I'm DONE debating how badly this looks....because such a debate detracts from the real point to take from this. Not one single game, free...indie...or AAA, EVER released has ever had this little info about their game once it was "near beta". IN fact....these guys use every last free resource they can find to showcase SOMETHING about the game to make sure players have an ideal about their product and how well it will hold up. Adventurine DOES NOT. They don't even have comparable information about their game to what most companies have when their game leaves internal testing. Hell, Blizzard had more information up when the game was still in concept form. These guys have felt their games was "near beta" for several years now. Near beta means the game is practically COMPLETE. As in, all key elements are IN place and have been past internal testing which ensures that the game will function once installed.
By every measure we possibly have to go by when viewing the hard facts about this....DF isn't even finished with internal testing. They have less gameplay showcased than some have even after internal. For us to assume the game is near beta....we must also then accept that this company doesn't WANT to show you anything solid about it. There are deliberately, and without reason, hiding their "holy grail" just to spite you. Either that, or there are SERIOUS problems and they do not want to showcase it. This would allow them time while they forced on ahead into beta to try and kill two birds with one stone. This concept is terrible.
There are worse things too....other horrible plots they COULD be working with that delve even further down this rabbit hole of screwing their fans.
The only fact here is that neither of us know what is possible or not. If Aventurine claims to be able to something and they are not, they and not us as consumers is going to get screwed. Why ? Because I will be able to test the game and see for myself before any money will change hands. If I don't like what I see, I will not buy. With a businessmodel like that, how on this earth will it be possible to get screwed ?
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And when we got more women on the team, it was like No, no, no. We need puppies and horses in there.
John Smedley, SOE
Darkfall isn't even in beta yet, so it might be one reason for the lack of information?
______________________________
The Sceptics, yes they're special but we've need them to.. I guess.
And if they're put more effort MMORPG.com can create a 'Team Sceptic'
and send them to the Special Olympus.
Yea how much info did oyu get before AOc or anyother game was in beta?
That has ZERO to do with this game. The devs themselves have said they almost released 2x already but didn't get the publishing deal they wanted. That being said, this game is supposedly ready. That means we should have all the information we need. That means that if they are still working on it, it should be nothing but polish at this time. Yet we get no beta and very sketchy information. Wonder why that is?
The reason for the serious lack of information is because "they got na'TING" as Sgt Shultz would say.
Fear not fanbois, we are not trolls, let's take off your tin foil hat and learn what VAPORWARE is:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vaporware
"Vaporware is a term used to describe a software or hardware product that is announced by a developer well in advance of release, but which then fails to emerge after having well exceeded the period of development time that was initially claimed or would normally be expected for the development cycle of a similar product."
Because they dont have apr departmeant and ig uess the devs have said they arent going to give of or shows us everything because they want us to find it for are selfs when we play it.. but hey you dont belive them so meh. I guess we will find out if there full of it wont we.
That has ZERO to do with this game. The devs themselves have said they almost released 2x already but didn't get the publishing deal they wanted. That being said, this game is supposedly ready. That means we should have all the information we need. That means that if they are still working on it, it should be nothing but polish at this time. Yet we get no beta and very sketchy information. Wonder why that is?
The reason for the serious lack of information is because "they got na'TING" as Sgt Shultz would say.
So you say that other games wasn't close to be done when they're were closed to beta/release? Or do you mean that they sould go out with all information about everything before beta? Or was all this drivel just so you should look smart when you wrote the last sentence? Please elaborate.
______________________________
The Sceptics, yes they're special but we've need them to.. I guess.
And if they're put more effort MMORPG.com can create a 'Team Sceptic'
and send them to the Special Olympus.
That has ZERO to do with this game. The devs themselves have said they almost released 2x already but didn't get the publishing deal they wanted. That being said, this game is supposedly ready. That means we should have all the information we need. That means that if they are still working on it, it should be nothing but polish at this time. Yet we get no beta and very sketchy information. Wonder why that is?
The reason for the serious lack of information is because "they got na'TING" as Sgt Shultz would say.
So you say that other games wasn't close to be done when they're were closed to beta/release? Or do you mean that they sould go out with all information about everything before beta? Or was all this drivel just so you should look smart when you wrote the last sentence? Please elaborate.
I thought it was pretty self explanatory:AoC devs: Games not ready, needs more polish, we're delaying.
Darkfall devs: Darkfall is ready now. We just need a publisher.....again.
Darkfall is always "ready for beta" and "just needing a publisher".
Sorry, you don't have this bad a time finding a publisher if your game is "ready". If the game is as "good" as you all think it is, and as "ready" as they continually claim it is, a smart publisher would agree to concessions from the devs, since they'd see the market potential. So far, none of them have seen it, I guess.
how did i miss this monster thread .................
I'm curious to what obvious market potential you are talking about ? It's not about smart or not, it's about the risk you are willing to take. If the potential is so great, how come 1 in 10 mmos out there are level based themepark games ? If it is new, the risk is greater. A great risk require a bigger piece of the income. If Aventurine, isn't willing to give them that, you have a problem agreeing on a deal. I don't know what is the truth here but it is an realistic alternative to "they have no publishers because the game is vaporware and/or suck".
---
And when we got more women on the team, it was like No, no, no. We need puppies and horses in there.
John Smedley, SOE
That has ZERO to do with this game. The devs themselves have said they almost released 2x already but didn't get the publishing deal they wanted. That being said, this game is supposedly ready. That means we should have all the information we need. That means that if they are still working on it, it should be nothing but polish at this time. Yet we get no beta and very sketchy information. Wonder why that is?
The reason for the serious lack of information is because "they got na'TING" as Sgt Shultz would say.
So you say that other games wasn't close to be done when they're were closed to beta/release? Or do you mean that they sould go out with all information about everything before beta? Or was all this drivel just so you should look smart when you wrote the last sentence? Please elaborate.
Personally i think she tried to look smart. Anybody else?
That has ZERO to do with this game. The devs themselves have said they almost released 2x already but didn't get the publishing deal they wanted. That being said, this game is supposedly ready. That means we should have all the information we need. That means that if they are still working on it, it should be nothing but polish at this time. Yet we get no beta and very sketchy information. Wonder why that is?
The reason for the serious lack of information is because "they got na'TING" as Sgt Shultz would say.
So you say that other games wasn't close to be done when they're were closed to beta/release? Or do you mean that they sould go out with all information about everything before beta? Or was all this drivel just so you should look smart when you wrote the last sentence? Please elaborate.
I thought it was pretty self explanatory:AoC devs: Games not ready, needs more polish, we're delaying.
Darkfall devs: Darkfall is ready now. We just need a publisher.....again.
Darkfall is always "ready for beta" and "just needing a publisher".
Sorry, you don't have this bad a time finding a publisher if your game is "ready". If the game is as "good" as you all think it is, and as "ready" as they continually claim it is, a smart publisher would agree to concessions from the devs, since they'd see the market potential. So far, none of them have seen it, I guess.
Aventurine is Darkfall publisher in one region.
http://www.warcry.com/articles/view/devjournals/darkfalljournals/3070-Darkfall-Dev-Journal-24-Full-Freedom-Gameplay-and-Substance.2
[QUOTE] Tasos Flambouras :Our progress with publishers is steady, unfortunately everyone moves at their own speed. Unless something unexpected happens, we are self-publishing in at least one territory so we've been working on that and using our time constructively to that end. [/QUOTE]
That has ZERO to do with this game. The devs themselves have said they almost released 2x already but didn't get the publishing deal they wanted. That being said, this game is supposedly ready. That means we should have all the information we need. That means that if they are still working on it, it should be nothing but polish at this time. Yet we get no beta and very sketchy information. Wonder why that is?
The reason for the serious lack of information is because "they got na'TING" as Sgt Shultz would say.
So you say that other games wasn't close to be done when they're were closed to beta/release? Or do you mean that they sould go out with all information about everything before beta? Or was all this drivel just so you should look smart when you wrote the last sentence? Please elaborate.
Personally i think she tried to look smart. Anybody else?
Shannia makes a totally valid point: either (a) the game is, as Aventurine claims, "ready to go except for a bit of final polish", in which case there would be NO good reason not to show a working model of DF in Beta, or at a gaming convention, or *somewhere*,
OR
(b) the game is not as ready as Aventurine claims, in which case they are lying.
Pretty obvious really, to (almost) everyone. Full credit to downtoearth, Aragon100 and Seggallion though for valiantly managing to draw out this non-debate for so many pages. Hoping you'll be the next "mystery guests" to be invited to Greece for a sniff around their internal testing labs, eh boys? Wouldn't hold your breath...