The AoC Developer said nothing wrong. Get over it. Focus on the HORRENDOUS stuff that others do, infact, say.
This topic isn't about what others do or say, it was about what this dev said.
No the AoC Dev didn't say anything wrong. Just unprofessional. Being unprofessional isn't wrong, SOE's been doing it for years. It's just bad business.
DF devs have DELAYED their beta (supposedly) because they've given release dates before and didn't make them. Whatever they are creating, it's been delayed. No release date has been scheduled so I guess it's true to say the game itself hasn't been delayed as far as releases go.
The AoC Developer said nothing wrong. Get over it. Focus on the HORRENDOUS stuff that others do, infact, say.
This topic isn't about what others do or say, it was about what this dev said.
No the AoC Dev didn't say anything wrong. Just unprofessional. Being unprofessional isn't wrong, SOE's been doing it for years. It's just bad business.
DF devs have DELAYED their beta (supposedly) because they've given release dates before and didn't make them. Whatever they are creating, it's been delayed. No release date has been scheduled so I guess it's true to say the game itself hasn't been delayed as far as releases go.
Ahh ok, supposedly delayed their beta correct? I'm not trying to take shots at you but that's what anyone that has actually been following this game would know correct? Would anyone mind telling me when they had an Alpha build?
Ahh ok, supposedly delayed their beta correct? I'm not trying to take shots at you but that's what anyone that has actually been following this game would know correct? Would anyone mind telling me when they had an Alpha build?
{ Mod Edit }
No company in the history of gaming has gotten caught with their hands in the cookie jar with "game play footage" that ended up being proven a mock-up. Right, McQuaid? Right, Stinnet? The list could go on and on. Athelan is spot on. Until these rookie devs show up at a gaming convetion with a product to show the public, the DFO devs need to just not say a word. They are next to Duke Nukem Forever on the definition of what VAPORWARE is for a reason.
Fear not fanbois, we are not trolls, let's take off your tin foil hat and learn what VAPORWARE is:
"Vaporware is a term used to describe a software or hardware product that is announced by a developer well in advance of release, but which then fails to emerge after having well exceeded the period of development time that was initially claimed or would normally be expected for the development cycle of a similar product."
Ahh ok, supposedly delayed their beta correct? I'm not trying to take shots at you but that's what anyone that has actually been following this game would know correct? Would anyone mind telling me when they had an Alpha build?
{ Mod Edit }
Waverat81, I agree with your point wholeheartedly. All I can say is that they knowingly said they delayed the beta. I don't follow darkfall nearly as much as other people, so I can't say too much on if they have a build or not ready for beta. They *did* have that one guild leader come out and test it, I'd suppose thats some sort of build, but everythings been kept so secretive it's hard to say.
All I can really say is that they've knowingly delayed themselves on their project be it real or fake.
As for mk, I don't know if you're calling me a "fanbois" but if you are, you haven't read a single post I've made yet. Secondly you HAVEN'T read a single post I've made seeing as how you're doing exactly what the AoC Dev did. An looking just as foolish, because you don't know anymore then I do if the game will actually be released or not.
According to that link, Darkfall has been in the final stages of internal beta testing for almost 4 years. What exactly is stopping them from moving to the next step?
The first quote was an obvious parody of the Devs idea of how Darkfall is marketing their game. The second quote is a cheap shot at the DF investors. By saying "some rich shieks son from the middle east" he's making light of their devolopment time and investor situation. It completely downplays DF's spending and initiative to produce results. The last quote the Dev exaggerates what the DF devs are trying to do. They try and make it sound like they aren't delivering, or could not/will not deliver when the AoC dev is obviously out of turn. He has no idea what the DF devs are capable of, and shouldn't hint at any future failures when at this point there isn't anything to base them off of. Right now theres not much to base anything off of, yet he still feels the need to knock another game subtly.
Well, I guess we all see what we want to. Bottom line is there isn't much to base anything off of, and that's the reason DF gets knocked on so much. It's not rocket science.
No I agree. But just as much as there isn't much to base things off of, there is just as much contrary information that makes the game look like its coming out. So arguing extremes on whether it will or will not come out isn't a great idea -- to me at least -- because you have no basis for stating either at this point -- which strangely on the same hand, you have a basis for stating both.
.... thats kinda messed up.
As for why they haven't released yet? I don't know... they've obviously stated now that they will self publish which is originally what they said they were waiting for. So who knows now what the reason would be. Maybe it's not what they expected so they keep working on it?
No I agree. But just as much as there isn't much to base things off of, there is just as much contrary information that makes the game look like its coming out. So arguing extremes on whether it will or will not come out isn't a great idea -- to me at least -- because you have no basis for stating either at this point -- which strangely on the same hand, you have a basis for stating both. .... thats kinda messed up. As for why they haven't released yet? I don't know... they've obviously stated now that they will self publish which is originally what they said they were waiting for. So who knows now what the reason would be. Maybe it's not what they expected so they keep working on it?
Darkfall is going to be a huge topic of debate until such a time as it either A: Releases B: Goes beta and gets trashed or praised to high hell or C: Gets canned.
Right now debating on Darkfall is like debating religion. There can never be a clear winner, and no one is ever right.
The sleeper awakes...and rides his dirtbike to the mall.
Still dont understand how they can talk shit , when weve seen more of AoC than darkfall in the what 7 years its been in development.
Darkfall devs take your heads out of your asses and show us something, then your trash talking will mean something until then you guys are just a bunch of tools who are wasting money and dont have anything but a few screnshots to show.
The game are still in alpha, so don't expect to much.
Vaporware hurts markets, no matter what the genre is. Game developers have every right to be upset by other game developers promising the world and having absolutely nothing to show for it.
here you have numerous would-be subscribers of different games biting at the bit to play darkfall. In the meantime, they jump from game to game and compare it on what darkfall promises, and in turn bash each game that doesnt measure up to what darkfall has promised.
until they start attending conventions and offering playable versions of their game to be previewed by reputable writers, the game is nothing more then empty promise luring gamers away from released games that an ethical game developer spent countless man hours on developing.
"If you want a picture of the future, imagine a robot foot stomping on a human face -- forever."
Asp but you called him and the devs liars. Yes, a fanboi from a guild hoping to get in good graces with the devs who just happened to be in the right place at the right time. Real reassuring.
Theres other ones but not all names are given. the publsihber have All the testers have. They have no publisher and no publishers have ever said they've been approached by Aventurine. The only "testers" have been supposedly "internal testers"; i.e. company people, family, friends, etc., in other words people who have a reason to lie for Aventurine. the people that connected from japan have. And yet there's no Japanese buzz? And not one beta tester saying "this game is good" or "this game sucks", as there are with every other game which has any sort of outside testers. And why would they only have Japanese testers, when as far as I've seen their market is EU and NA? there more but i cnat think of them because im tired and why bother youll just say there lieing anyways I'm sorry. You go get some rest now, and come back with some more when you can remember.
they have let people play it but you choose nto to beleive them. Thats not there fault thats yours alone
It's our fault that it's very difficult to hold credibility to a company that is as secretive as Aventurine has been with Darkfall? Ever heard of Mourning? Thrones of Chaos? If the developers of Darkfall really felt they had such a good product, why do they only acknowledge the community once or twice a year? Release 2 or 3 screenshots once or twice a year? It's public knowledge what features they say their game has, why keep it behind such closed doors?
Well compared to Darkfall, AoC actually has a product. I feel like they have every right to take shots at Darkfall, maybe something good will come out of it, like some "news" from the Darkfall team, or maybe it'll pressure them into shaping up, that is if they even have any work in "progress" in the first place.
But yah, Darkfall deserves to be made fun of, 7 years, and nothing yet.
I am definately bringing this thread back next year when the game doesn't release.....
That should be good for a quick giggle...
__________________________________________________ In memory of Laura "Taera" Genender. Passed away on Aug/13/08 - Rest In Peace; you will not be forgotten
Your probably right about the PR issue in some form. What there reason is for not being more open minded is a bit of a puzzle to be honest. Hopefully we get some clarifications about the state of the game in near future. Seems were about to get a new video about Conquest in near future.=) Lets hope that one show us some more of the features and why not some NPC:s too.=) Seems there is alot of WoW players wanna join Darkfall btw. Was a newly made poll about where the followers of today is coming from.
I actually find that poll a tad misleading.
See....its not really fair to use the WoW answer in the poll for anything. You could ask ANYTHING and get that many hits from WoW playerbase. Its just that large. You could have a poll which asked which games players like beating up old ladies...and WoW would ALSO likely command the highest results. Whats worse is that WoW players are mostly new to the genre...and have already been spoiled by the ease of that game. While I'm very certain some of them are looking into Sandbox games, whether they actually stick to them once the game isn't holding their hand through everything has yet to be seen.
Worse yet....do you really want the barrens chat crowd filling up your game? Honestly? Because thats a sure fire way to watch the game implode.
Beyond that, I'm glad we have reached a point where we can discuss and be open minded about it. The fact that you will admit when I've made a point while still remaining to your own side in the debate is kinda nice. You more definitely do not embody the sort of DF fan I've been making war with. Just remember...the vast majority of WoW's players are twice as fickle as regular MMO'ers are, and we are ALL pretty darn fickle. They have also experienced a game that had a TON of customer support and constant updates. They will not find DF remotely comparable to the care Blizzard shows its own product even if it DOES release...simply because Adventurine will not have the financial backing Blizzard did in order to pay for the employees it will need to stand up against it.
Also, many old EQ fans "tried" the other sandbox games too. You'll notice that most did not stick with it, and chose to go back to gear grinds. There is ALWAYS an exception to the rule...but business does not base its course of action around exceptions to the rule. This fact will hold true for many years still: Players that love them some classes and gear will continue to do so. The ones of us that actually like sandbox games AND come from Classic MMO's did so because there were no sandboxes once UO went down the tubes and SOE killed SWG.
Either way, fans of a gaming style will very often stick TO that style. Especially when a monthly fee is involved. When talking about a company fearing ANYTHING...its always important to be mindful that corps only ever fear same-type competition. DF and AoC are clearly not even close to being the same type of game at all. They also, very clearly, appeal to different gamers...a point made clear by both teams. The success of one will not affect the other. AoC or DF (assuming its real) would only live or die by their own merits...not the comparing of each others merits. Sandbox players really won't give a hoot about AoC, a fact I am a clear example of. I'm not interested in AoC, as it does not offer what I currently seek. Should I want to play a Classic MMO, I would rather play WoW...as it already has far more support and time put into it. I've no desire to spend money on the "chance" another classic MMO will strike me.
Athelan is basically right in everything he says, whether or not you find it tasteless. The difference at the end of the day is that AoC will actually be released. Sorry, but that's reality.
If it were up to me, the Darkfall forums on this website would be shut down until the game had either a publisher, an officially announced release date, or a pre-order ability from amazon.com or EBgames.Frankly until Darkfall has just ONE of those SIMPLE things, no one should even give this game a second thought.
If you've ever met Athelan, you'd know that he is a straight shooter with an edge to him. I met him at DragonCon '07 and yes, he is an ass. So the fact that he'd make comments like this are no surprise, but he does speak the truth. Again, the Darkfall Online devs need to put up or shut up because at least Athelan has released games. It is more than we can say about any of the staff that we know of working on the DFO project. IMHO of course.
Fear not fanbois, we are not trolls, let's take off your tin foil hat and learn what VAPORWARE is:
"Vaporware is a term used to describe a software or hardware product that is announced by a developer well in advance of release, but which then fails to emerge after having well exceeded the period of development time that was initially claimed or would normally be expected for the development cycle of a similar product."
If you've ever met Athelan, you'd know that he is a straight shooter with an edge to him. I met him at DragonCon '07 and yes, he is an ass. So the fact that he'd make comments like this are no surprise, but he does speak the truth. Again, the Darkfall Online devs need to put up or shut up because at least Athelan has released games. It is more than we can say about any of the staff that we know of working on the DFO project. IMHO of course.
Athelan doesn't know what state DF in and what it can or cannot do. Just because he or his fellow devs aren't talented to pull something like DF off, doesn't mean the DF devs cannot do it. Athelan should shut up and talking about things he is more knowledgeable about. Like overhyping games and hope that preorders will save AoC.
--- And when we got more women on the team, it was like No, no, no. We need puppies and horses in there. John Smedley, SOE
You guys never heard of actully getting in trouble from breaking non disclousre agreemeants have you?
thre is such things if you sign it and you break it you can go to jail If you dont believe me thent hats your fault. its probly had some ahrsh penaltys for breaking it to think other wise. I really dont know about you guys i feel like we are waisting are time here . Because youw ill find out here if we are fan boys or just know what we are talking about.
My small clan composed of friends and friends of friends' amounting to 40 people approximately got clan beta, we are STILL waiting for it to start though - this was in year 2006. Some rumors are going that there is a clan beta going on as we speak but I don't believe in that. No, our small clan has not signed NDA or agreed upon any terms. (Nidvardir is my AoC guild if you are wondering and doesn't relate to DF)
I hope and believe that the game will be a success.
Comments
This topic isn't about what others do or say, it was about what this dev said.
No the AoC Dev didn't say anything wrong. Just unprofessional. Being unprofessional isn't wrong, SOE's been doing it for years. It's just bad business.
DF devs have DELAYED their beta (supposedly) because they've given release dates before and didn't make them. Whatever they are creating, it's been delayed. No release date has been scheduled so I guess it's true to say the game itself hasn't been delayed as far as releases go.
This topic isn't about what others do or say, it was about what this dev said.
No the AoC Dev didn't say anything wrong. Just unprofessional. Being unprofessional isn't wrong, SOE's been doing it for years. It's just bad business.
DF devs have DELAYED their beta (supposedly) because they've given release dates before and didn't make them. Whatever they are creating, it's been delayed. No release date has been scheduled so I guess it's true to say the game itself hasn't been delayed as far as releases go.
Ahh ok, supposedly delayed their beta correct? I'm not trying to take shots at you but that's what anyone that has actually been following this game would know correct? Would anyone mind telling me when they had an Alpha build?
{ Mod Edit }No company in the history of gaming has gotten caught with their hands in the cookie jar with "game play footage" that ended up being proven a mock-up. Right, McQuaid? Right, Stinnet? The list could go on and on. Athelan is spot on. Until these rookie devs show up at a gaming convetion with a product to show the public, the DFO devs need to just not say a word. They are next to Duke Nukem Forever on the definition of what VAPORWARE is for a reason.
Fear not fanbois, we are not trolls, let's take off your tin foil hat and learn what VAPORWARE is:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vaporware
"Vaporware is a term used to describe a software or hardware product that is announced by a developer well in advance of release, but which then fails to emerge after having well exceeded the period of development time that was initially claimed or would normally be expected for the development cycle of a similar product."
{ Mod Edit }Waverat81, I agree with your point wholeheartedly. All I can say is that they knowingly said they delayed the beta. I don't follow darkfall nearly as much as other people, so I can't say too much on if they have a build or not ready for beta. They *did* have that one guild leader come out and test it, I'd suppose thats some sort of build, but everythings been kept so secretive it's hard to say.
All I can really say is that they've knowingly delayed themselves on their project be it real or fake.
As for mk, I don't know if you're calling me a "fanbois" but if you are, you haven't read a single post I've made yet. Secondly you HAVEN'T read a single post I've made seeing as how you're doing exactly what the AoC Dev did. An looking just as foolish, because you don't know anymore then I do if the game will actually be released or not.
http://www.gamershell.com/news_19163.html
According to that link, Darkfall has been in the final stages of internal beta testing for almost 4 years. What exactly is stopping them from moving to the next step?
Well, I guess we all see what we want to. Bottom line is there isn't much to base anything off of, and that's the reason DF gets knocked on so much. It's not rocket science.
No I agree. But just as much as there isn't much to base things off of, there is just as much contrary information that makes the game look like its coming out. So arguing extremes on whether it will or will not come out isn't a great idea -- to me at least -- because you have no basis for stating either at this point -- which strangely on the same hand, you have a basis for stating both.
.... thats kinda messed up.
As for why they haven't released yet? I don't know... they've obviously stated now that they will self publish which is originally what they said they were waiting for. So who knows now what the reason would be. Maybe it's not what they expected so they keep working on it?
Right now debating on Darkfall is like debating religion. There can never be a clear winner, and no one is ever right.
The sleeper awakes...and rides his dirtbike to the mall.
What do you mean by when you was?
The game are still in alpha, so don't expect to much.
Man, what a long alpha: mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/post/1918888#1918888
Vaporware hurts markets, no matter what the genre is. Game developers have every right to be upset by other game developers promising the world and having absolutely nothing to show for it.
here you have numerous would-be subscribers of different games biting at the bit to play darkfall. In the meantime, they jump from game to game and compare it on what darkfall promises, and in turn bash each game that doesnt measure up to what darkfall has promised.
until they start attending conventions and offering playable versions of their game to be previewed by reputable writers, the game is nothing more then empty promise luring gamers away from released games that an ethical game developer spent countless man hours on developing.
"If you want a picture of the future, imagine a robot foot stomping on a human face -- forever."
they have let people play it but you choose nto to beleive them. Thats not there fault thats yours alone
List them.
Asp but you called him and the devs liars.
Theres other ones but not all names are given. the publsihber have All the testers have.
the people that connected from japan have.
there more but i cnat think of them because im tired and why bother youll just say there lieing anyways
Well compared to Darkfall, AoC actually has a product. I feel like they have every right to take shots at Darkfall, maybe something good will come out of it, like some "news" from the Darkfall team, or maybe it'll pressure them into shaping up, that is if they even have any work in "progress" in the first place.
But yah, Darkfall deserves to be made fun of, 7 years, and nothing yet.
GG. Darkfall got pwned.
I am definately bringing this thread back next year when the game doesn't release.....
That should be good for a quick giggle...
__________________________________________________
In memory of Laura "Taera" Genender. Passed away on Aug/13/08 - Rest In Peace; you will not be forgotten
I actually find that poll a tad misleading.
See....its not really fair to use the WoW answer in the poll for anything. You could ask ANYTHING and get that many hits from WoW playerbase. Its just that large. You could have a poll which asked which games players like beating up old ladies...and WoW would ALSO likely command the highest results. Whats worse is that WoW players are mostly new to the genre...and have already been spoiled by the ease of that game. While I'm very certain some of them are looking into Sandbox games, whether they actually stick to them once the game isn't holding their hand through everything has yet to be seen.
Worse yet....do you really want the barrens chat crowd filling up your game? Honestly? Because thats a sure fire way to watch the game implode.
Beyond that, I'm glad we have reached a point where we can discuss and be open minded about it. The fact that you will admit when I've made a point while still remaining to your own side in the debate is kinda nice. You more definitely do not embody the sort of DF fan I've been making war with. Just remember...the vast majority of WoW's players are twice as fickle as regular MMO'ers are, and we are ALL pretty darn fickle. They have also experienced a game that had a TON of customer support and constant updates. They will not find DF remotely comparable to the care Blizzard shows its own product even if it DOES release...simply because Adventurine will not have the financial backing Blizzard did in order to pay for the employees it will need to stand up against it.
Also, many old EQ fans "tried" the other sandbox games too. You'll notice that most did not stick with it, and chose to go back to gear grinds. There is ALWAYS an exception to the rule...but business does not base its course of action around exceptions to the rule. This fact will hold true for many years still: Players that love them some classes and gear will continue to do so. The ones of us that actually like sandbox games AND come from Classic MMO's did so because there were no sandboxes once UO went down the tubes and SOE killed SWG.
Either way, fans of a gaming style will very often stick TO that style. Especially when a monthly fee is involved. When talking about a company fearing ANYTHING...its always important to be mindful that corps only ever fear same-type competition. DF and AoC are clearly not even close to being the same type of game at all. They also, very clearly, appeal to different gamers...a point made clear by both teams. The success of one will not affect the other. AoC or DF (assuming its real) would only live or die by their own merits...not the comparing of each others merits. Sandbox players really won't give a hoot about AoC, a fact I am a clear example of. I'm not interested in AoC, as it does not offer what I currently seek. Should I want to play a Classic MMO, I would rather play WoW...as it already has far more support and time put into it. I've no desire to spend money on the "chance" another classic MMO will strike me.
Athelan is basically right in everything he says, whether or not you find it tasteless. The difference at the end of the day is that AoC will actually be released. Sorry, but that's reality.
If it were up to me, the Darkfall forums on this website would be shut down until the game had either a publisher, an officially announced release date, or a pre-order ability from amazon.com or EBgames.Frankly until Darkfall has just ONE of those SIMPLE things, no one should even give this game a second thought.
If you've ever met Athelan, you'd know that he is a straight shooter with an edge to him. I met him at DragonCon '07 and yes, he is an ass. So the fact that he'd make comments like this are no surprise, but he does speak the truth. Again, the Darkfall Online devs need to put up or shut up because at least Athelan has released games. It is more than we can say about any of the staff that we know of working on the DFO project. IMHO of course.
Fear not fanbois, we are not trolls, let's take off your tin foil hat and learn what VAPORWARE is:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vaporware
"Vaporware is a term used to describe a software or hardware product that is announced by a developer well in advance of release, but which then fails to emerge after having well exceeded the period of development time that was initially claimed or would normally be expected for the development cycle of a similar product."
Heh ... an AoC developer - a game that is now officially just glorified adware - takes makes cheap shots at a proper game.
Athelan doesn't know what state DF in and what it can or cannot do. Just because he or his fellow devs aren't talented to pull something like DF off, doesn't mean the DF devs cannot do it. Athelan should shut up and talking about things he is more knowledgeable about. Like overhyping games and hope that preorders will save AoC.
---
And when we got more women on the team, it was like No, no, no. We need puppies and horses in there.
John Smedley, SOE
You guys never heard of actully getting in trouble from breaking non disclousre agreemeants have you?
thre is such things if you sign it and you break it you can go to jail If you dont believe me thent hats your fault. its probly had some ahrsh penaltys for breaking it to think other wise. I really dont know about you guys i feel like we are waisting are time here . Because youw ill find out here if we are fan boys or just know what we are talking about.
My small clan composed of friends and friends of friends' amounting to 40 people approximately got clan beta, we are STILL waiting for it to start though - this was in year 2006. Some rumors are going that there is a clan beta going on as we speak but I don't believe in that. No, our small clan has not signed NDA or agreed upon any terms. (Nidvardir is my AoC guild if you are wondering and doesn't relate to DF)
I hope and believe that the game will be a success.