Huh, you heard it on a live stream and nobody else on the entire Internet focused on that. Cool story bro.
I also like how you re-direct the conversation saying that we're ignoring what's really important, but you never linked anything that was really important either, so wtf is the point that we're supposed to be getting?
Still pissed of because I prove you wrong all the time? You are the one redirecting the conversation. I am not guilty for your comprehension issues and your hate by me, that makes you just put your focus on trying to dismiss what I am saying, instead listening to what I am saying....
So here's the point again, since you are playing the dummy guy:
The backers who paid the original are getting for free. But the backers who paid for the expanded, will have to pay additional dollars... in other words, the majority of the backers are paying for this expanded Behind Enemy Lines but won't have the right to get a copy of it. Will have to pay for it again.
"The first Squadron 42 mission disk, Behind Enemy Lines, will be available for free to all backers who pledge before $6 million upon release."
I think that you're confusing the meaning of "proving" and "saying nothing". You talk an awful lot, but say nothing. Even yesterday you were asked for a link to back up your claims and you gave nothing. You link stuff about laws surrounding deception, but then go on to make the assumption that CIG is being intentionally deceptive. So even the things that you link are contextually irrelevant.
I'm still not getting your point. You just linked to something that specifically states that people who backed before $6 million will get it free. Also, Behind Enemy Lines is the SECOND episode of S42, not the first. Every backer gets the first episode of S42 for free. It's about 20 hours of gameplay, and that's straight from the mouth of CR himself.
I'm so happy that you proved me wrong once again, though. Please, feel free to find some more unsupported data or wildly speculative information that I can shoot down with a straw and some chewed up paper.
Huh, you heard it on a live stream and nobody else on the entire Internet focused on that. Cool story bro.
I also like how you re-direct the conversation saying that we're ignoring what's really important, but you never linked anything that was really important either, so wtf is the point that we're supposed to be getting?
Still pissed of because I prove you wrong all the time? You are the one redirecting the conversation. I am not guilty for your comprehension issues and your hate by me, that makes you just put your focus on trying to dismiss what I am saying, instead listening to what I am saying....
So here's the point again, since you are playing the dummy guy:
The backers who paid the original are getting for free. But the backers who paid for the expanded, will have to pay additional dollars... in other words, the majority of the backers are paying for this expanded Behind Enemy Lines but won't have the right to get a copy of it. Will have to pay for it again.
"The first Squadron 42 mission disk, Behind Enemy Lines, will be available for free to all backers who pledge before $6 million upon release."
I think that you're confusing the meaning of "proving" and "saying nothing". You talk an awful lot, but say nothing. Even yesterday you were asked for a link to back up your claims and you gave nothing. You link stuff about laws surrounding deception, but then go on to make the assumption that CIG is being intentionally deceptive. So even the things that you link are contextually irrelevant.
I'm still not getting your point. You just linked to something that specifically states that people who backed before $6 million will get it free. Also, Behind Enemy Lines is the SECOND episode of S42, not the first. Every backer gets the first episode of S42 for free. It's about 20 hours of gameplay, and that's straight from the mouth of CR himself.
I'm so happy that you proved me wrong once again, though. Please, feel free to find some more unsupported data or wildly speculative information that I can shoot down with a straw and some chewed up paper.
/sarcasm
I am not guitly by your lack of comprehension.
1-) The link that you persisted should be about a cost of 150 million dollars for the trilogy. A number which is irrelevant to the point that I raised. It could be 100, 50, 1 billion, it was irrelevant to my point, how exact would be that number. That is what you were asking for. But that was not my point in that discussion. So you twisted my point and tried to focus in something that was out of the context of the discussion and the point raised. You went to the point of saying that "it wouldn't matter" even if I provided such link... because blablabla, taking conclusions that had nothing to do with what I am saying. And I tried to reply more than one time, explaining what I was saying. You purposefully ignored.
2-) My link of FTC was about the deceptive advertising in legal perspective, since people confuse "deceptive advertising", which is a matter of a law, with the meaning of the word "deception". In the explanation, becomes clear that there is no "intention" required to be proven, so a company be guilty of doing deceptive advertising. Because its their legal obligation to use the techniques to do not make ambiguous, misleading offers, or omit important information, that if not omitted, would make consumers do not buy/pledge. You twisted totally what was said and went to the point of saying that was needed intention proven, or a court would dismiss, which just shown your absolute lack of comprehension about the clear statements of FTC, that you just want to refuse to understand. So, your comprehension is getting everything in the opposite of what that means. Then, I went in a discussion with other user, not you, to prove the point that, regardless not needed, legally, to prove intention so CIG be guilty of deceptive advertising, of breaking this law, STILL, is possible to prove them been deceptive intentionally (unnecessary, but its possible). But you are so easily confused due your lack of comprehension and knowledge about the law, even when the authority statements try to clarify to you, which I guess, has been caused by your fanaticism for Star Citizen, the denial, so it's not really possible to clarify anything for you, because you are just with your twisted mind, fighting a "war" against the "evil" who "want to destroy Star Citizen". It's all in your mind and in the mind of other cultists. But don't worry. Everyone else, without the fanaticism of a fan, understood my point, according with some private messages that I received.
3-) I didn't say that BEL is the first episode. It's indeed the second. And there is a third, unnamed. The point, which I am going to repeat for the third time, is that people already paid for them. Chris Roberts stated, that with the funds raised, while ago, they expanded Squadron 42 to become a trilogy. The first episode was expanded. The second and third were expanded. All they were expanded, BECAUSE, people who pledged AFTER the 6 million mark, pledged more money... exponentially more, I mean... almost 17 times more. Still, all these people will have to pay for a copy of those campaigns. Which is ridiculous, from a consumer point of view and that was the point of the conversation that I was having, not with you, but with other person.
4-) "Please, feel free to find some more unsupported data"... yeah... a FTC statement, the organization which regulates the matter in United States: "Unsupported data... wildly speculative information"
1-) The link that you persisted should be about a cost of 150 million dollars for the trilogy. A number which is irrelevant to the point that I raised. It could be 100, 50, 1 billion, it was irrelevant to my point, how exact would be that number. That is what you were asking for. But that was not my point in that discussion. So you twisted my point and tried to focus in something that was out of the context of the discussion and the point raised. You went to the point of saying that "it wouldn't matter" even if I provided such link... because blablabla, taking conclusions that had nothing to do with what I am saying. And I tried to reply more than one time, explaining what I was saying. You purposefully ignored.
2-) My link of FTC was about the deceptive advertising in legal perspective, since people confuse "deceptive advertising", which is a matter of a law, with the meaning of the word "deception". In the explanation, becomes clear that there is no "intention" required to be proven, so a company be guilty of doing deceptive advertising. Because its their legal obligation to use the techniques to do not make ambiguous, misleading offers, or omit important information, that if not omitted, would make consumers do not buy/pledge. You twisted totally what was said and went to the point of saying that was needed intention proven, or a court would dismiss, which just shown your absolute lack of comprehension about the clear statements of FTC, that you just want to refuse to understand. So, your comprehension is getting everything in the opposite of what that means. Then, I went in a discussion with other user, not you, to prove the point that, regardless not needed, legally, to prove intention so CIG be guilty of deceptive advertising, of breaking this law, STILL, is possible to prove them been deceptive intentionally (unnecessary, but its possible). But you are so easily confused due your lack of comprehension and knowledge about the law, even when the authority statements try to clarify to you, which I guess, has been caused by your fanaticism for Star Citizen, the denial, so it's not really possible to clarify anything for you, because you are just with your twisted mind, fighting a "war" against the "evil" who "want to destroy Star Citizen". It's all in your mind and in the mind of other cultists. But don't worry. Everyone else, without the fanaticism of a fan, understood my point, according with some private messages that I received.
3-) I didn't say that BEL is the first episode. It's indeed the second. And there is a third, unnamed. The point, which I am going to repeat for the third time, is that people already paid for them. Chris Roberts stated, that with the funds raised, while ago, they expanded Squadron 42 to become a trilogy. The first episode was expanded. The second and third were expanded. All they were expanded, BECAUSE, people who pledged AFTER the 6 million mark, pledged more money... exponentially more, I mean... almost 17 times more. Still, all these people will have to pay for a copy of those campaigns. Which is ridiculous, from a consumer point of view and that was the point of the conversation that I was having, not with you, but with other person.
4-) "Please, feel free to find some more unsupported data"... yeah... a FTC statement, the organization which regulates the matter in United States: "Unsupported data... wildly speculative information"
1) YOU GAVE THE LINK!!! Not only that but you quoted from it! It had nothing to do with $150 million.
2) Lol, again, you lean on fanboyism as an explanation for why someone refutes evidence that you bring up. Honestly, truthfully, please prove something, anything. I really wish you would. If you could prove something about this game and put it to bed then I wouldn't have to argue with you. It's not about being a fanboy or a white knight, it's about being factual and correct, neither of which you seem to be able to accomplish. Yes, there are laws about deceptive marketing. If you are THAT convinced about their deceptive practices then launch a lawsuit yourself. Based on what you're saying it's a slam dunk!
3) Where does it say that people paid for this trilogy? You LITERALLY gave a link that said that everyone up until the $6 million mark would get up to BEL for free. We are over $100 million in. This stretch goal was set at the $6 million mark. How much earlier could this have been set? That expectation was set literally over 3 years ago (11/12/2012). I can appreciate if you feel like the model of paying for episodic content is ridiculous, but just say that. Don't claim it's deceptive. You know what, if you don't like that model, you don't have to buy it, or buy the game at all for that matter.
4) I never disputed that the FTC statement was not accurate, but it's completely irrelevant. You're claiming that CIG is being intentionally deceptive, and then link to a definition of what that is as evidence. See, again, you seem to have a misunderstanding of what "proof" is. You should google it.
1) YOU GAVE THE LINK!!! Not only that but you quoted from it! It had nothing to do with $150 million.
2) Lol, again, you lean on fanboyism as an explanation for why someone refutes evidence that you bring up. Honestly, truthfully, please prove something, anything. I really wish you would. If you could prove something about this game and put it to bed then I wouldn't have to argue with you. It's not about being a fanboy or a white knight, it's about being factual and correct, neither of which you seem to be able to accomplish. Yes, there are laws about deceptive marketing. If you are THAT convinced about their deceptive practices then launch a lawsuit yourself. Based on what you're saying it's a slam dunk!
3) Where does it say that people paid for this trilogy? You LITERALLY gave a link that said that everyone up until the $6 million mark would get up to BEL for free. We are over $100 million in. This stretch goal was set at the $6 million mark. How much earlier could this have been set? That expectation was set literally over 3 years ago (11/12/2012). I can appreciate if you feel like the model of paying for episodic content is ridiculous, but just say that. Don't claim it's deceptive. You know what, if you don't like that model, you don't have to buy it, or buy the game at all for that matter.
4) I never disputed that the FTC statement was not accurate, but it's completely irrelevant. You're claiming that CIG is being intentionally deceptive, and then link to a definition of what that is as evidence. See, again, you seem to have a misunderstanding of what "proof" is. You should google it.
1) I Gave the link that was relevant to the point that I raised and you were focusing in another thing.
2) "It's not about being a fanboy or a white knight, it's about being factual and correct" Yes. That's what i did. You failed to see because your mind is twisted, clouded by your passion.
3) Where does it say that people paid for this trilogy? "We are over $100 million in. This stretch goal was set at the $6 million mark." You answered your own question.
4) "I never disputed that the FTC statement was not accurate, but it's completely irrelevant." Wait. What? First you asked me to be factual and correct. And if I am factual and correct, you say that it's completely irrelevant. Ok pal. I cant win from this You have all covered
"You're claiming that CIG is being intentionally deceptive" Not in the way that you claimed. I claimed that CIG was deceptive first. And then I claimed that, regardless not needed, its possible to prove they been deceptive "intentionally". And for that, I had a conversation with other guy which I presented all the points that you are asking for. He also used your same tactic. Of twisting the conversation and ignoring the arguments, focusing in one thing that out of scope, didn't mean what I was saying. One of these points is that CIG changed a clause of their own TOS to expand a time where they should give the refunds to people. This is been intentionally deceptive, because first, they made a clause that was supposed to work as a warranty to people who pledged... then, they removed that warranty, and made people obligated to accept that, or, wouldn't have the ability to play what they paid for and were warranted previously. That is pretty much, irrefutable proof of been intentionally deceptive. Once again, and to be clear, totally unnecessary if we were disputing this in a lawsuit. In a lawsuit just would stay the fact that the clause is deceptive, regardless stories of how that happened or excuses that could be given. It's deceptive. Period. Excuses don't matter, because the company failed in its legal responsibility. Lets calculate the fines. Pretty much that is what would happen, legally. But, I just pointed this to show how far they go and how not reliable they are, because its not accident. They are intentionally shady. And I gave other examples too. Like Roberts intentionally denying to people that the game, with expanded scope would cause delays (feature creep), and later, he saying that "was obvious that would take longer". So, why he denied that and tried to claim that people who thought that would be obvious that would take longer, were wrong, and he had everything covered? He knew that was obvious. But was convenient to deny in that time, when he was looking for 20 million dollars. He was intentionally deceptive here, and its proven by the own contradiction of his statements. So, "google it" in case you are unable to go back a few pages and read, without putting your passion and hate and obsession to advertise this game, to cloud your ability to analyse what is said.
1) YOU GAVE THE LINK!!! Not only that but you quoted from it! It had nothing to do with $150 million.
2) Lol, again, you lean on fanboyism as an explanation for why someone refutes evidence that you bring up. Honestly, truthfully, please prove something, anything. I really wish you would. If you could prove something about this game and put it to bed then I wouldn't have to argue with you. It's not about being a fanboy or a white knight, it's about being factual and correct, neither of which you seem to be able to accomplish. Yes, there are laws about deceptive marketing. If you are THAT convinced about their deceptive practices then launch a lawsuit yourself. Based on what you're saying it's a slam dunk!
3) Where does it say that people paid for this trilogy? You LITERALLY gave a link that said that everyone up until the $6 million mark would get up to BEL for free. We are over $100 million in. This stretch goal was set at the $6 million mark. How much earlier could this have been set? That expectation was set literally over 3 years ago (11/12/2012). I can appreciate if you feel like the model of paying for episodic content is ridiculous, but just say that. Don't claim it's deceptive. You know what, if you don't like that model, you don't have to buy it, or buy the game at all for that matter.
4) I never disputed that the FTC statement was not accurate, but it's completely irrelevant. You're claiming that CIG is being intentionally deceptive, and then link to a definition of what that is as evidence. See, again, you seem to have a misunderstanding of what "proof" is. You should google it.
1) I Gave the link that was relevant to the point that I raised and you were focusing in another thing.
2) "It's not about being a fanboy or a white knight, it's about being factual and correct" Yes. That's what i did. You failed to see because your mind is twisted, clouded by your passion.
3) Where does it say that people paid for this trilogy? "We are over $100 million in. This stretch goal was set at the $6 million mark." You answered your own question.
4) "I never disputed that the FTC statement was not accurate, but it's completely irrelevant." Wait. What? First you asked me to be factual and correct. And if I am factual and correct, you say that it's completely irrelevant. Ok pal. I can win from this You have all covered
"You're claiming that CIG is being intentionally deceptive" No. I claimed that CIG was deceptive first. And then I claimed that, regardless not needed, its possible to prove they been deceptive. And for that, I had a conversation with other guy which I presented all the points that you are asking for. One of them, is that CIG changed a clause of their own TOS to expand a time where they should give the refunds to people. This is been intentionally deceptive, because first, they made a clause that was supposed to work as a warranty to people who pledged... then, they removed that warranty, and made people obligated to accept that, or, wouldn't have the ability to play what they paid for and were warranted previously. That is pretty much, irrefutable proof of been intentionally deceptive. Once again, and to be clear, totally unnecessary if we were disputing this in a lawsuit. In a lawsuit just would stay the fact that the clause is deceptive, regardless stories of how that happened or excuses that could be given. It's deceptive. Period. Excuses don't matter, because the company failed in its legal responsibility. Lets calculate the fines. Pretty much that is what would happen, legally. But, I just pointed this to show how far they go and how not reliable they are, because its not accident. They are intentionally shady. And I gave other examples too. So, "google it" in case you are unable to go back a few pages and read, without putting your passion and hate and obsession to advertise this game, to cloud your ability to analyse what is said.
Ok, I can probably have a more coherent argument with my 8 year-old, and he'd probably give more proof too. I honestly can't make out a single sentence that you're saying. I don't even know what the hell you're arguing. I guess I'm a fanboy and you've managed to prove all of your points with subjective information.
You claimed to be a lawyer at one time. Do you really believe that the case you've presented would stand up in court?
What I am finding funny about all of these arguments on the numerous threads is that those who are so venomously against this game are providing the most media coverage. Every negative post brings these threads to the surface.
Then you have those who are interested to see all the drama, a curiosity is sparked, to see if there is any truth to positive or negative allegations. People then decide based on their own investigation what is going on. And some of those people decide to back the game.
So I applaud all of you, keep up the publicity, we can use the increased funding you provide to the game.
You claimed to be a lawyer at one time. Do you really believe that the case you've presented would stand up in court?
Of course. Easy cake. It just needs someone motivated to pursuit that, just one guy, decided to spend their money and time on that. That is what CIG is counting on: That luckily nobody will bother to go further, "because its just a game, people just move on". But they are going beyond the limits of underestimating this possibility, by the way that they are pushing people both on investing money and passion. If you want to protect CIG, you should try to hold CIG, for the sake of your investiment and wish for this succeeds.
In fact, their biggest issue for the future of Star Citizen lies outside of the court. They don't need a court to ruin them. They are ruining themselves, just to make the "wife's plan" work in the moment... ignoring the effects... they are been irresponsible and short-sighted... and I already explained all that in details in other post, so "google it" if you are interested.
I also tried to help them giving a feedback to Sandi/Roberts/Lesnick regarding how the community was becoming toxic and how that, in the medium/long term would impact CIG negativelly, working more against them instead in favor of them and how their polices and attitude were just encouraging something that would become a real problem... I guess I was vindicated about this already, since all the press outlets already wrote in agreement or with tips of ironies about that.
Interesting that its the main reason that made Sandi/Roberts hating me so much (per the own Sandi's answer to me in the past, plus, of course, how angry she become when I gave a feedback praising another girl, instead her, assuming that praising another girl by his good service provide meant that "I was fobbing her" - she said), to the point of doing what they did (or probably Sandi did and the other guys just came to help and make the damage control), in my particular case, which was a true shame for them and they try their best to hide.
"A waste of her and CEO's time" - she said. I invite her to publicize that email and let's all see what was that feedback that was ignored was about, and if it was really reasonable to consider "a waste of time", considering how many issues could be avoided if they worked to solve the gaps that I pointed ealier 2013
Unfortunately, those people have more ego than professionalism.
You claimed to be a lawyer at one time. Do you really believe that the case you've presented would stand up in court?
Of course. Easy cake. It just needs someone motivated to pursuit that, just one guy, decided to spend their money and time on that. That is what CIG is counting on: That luckily nobody will bother to go further, "because its just a game, people just move on". But they are going beyond the limits of underestimating this possibility, by the way that they are pushing people both on investing money and passion. If you want to protect CIG, you should try to hold CIG, for the sake of your investiment and wish for this succeeds.
In fact, their biggest issue for the future of Star Citizen lies outside of the court. They don't need a court to ruin them. They are ruining themselves, just to make the "wife's plan" work in the moment... ignoring the effects... they are been irresponsible and short-sighted... and I already explained all that in details in other post, so "google it" if you are interested.
I also tried to help them giving a feedback to Sandi/Roberts/Lesnick regarding how the community was becoming toxic and how that, in the medium/long term would impact CIG negativelly, working more against them in favor of them... I guess I was vindicated about this, specially because that was the reason that made Sandi/Roberts hating me so much, to the point of doing what they did, in my particular case. "A waste of her and CEO's time" - she said. I invite her to publicize that email and let's all see what was the feedback that was ignored, was "a waste of time" and how many issues could be avoided if they worked to solve the gaps that I pointed ealier 2013 Unfortunately, those people have more ego than professionalism.
Well Derek already said he was going to pledge $2 million to a lawsuit, so why don't you call him up. I know you've got him on speed dial. If your case is a slam dunk or "easy cake" as you put it, then I'm sure you'll have no problem getting it done quickly and easily. Why spend your time on the forums when you could be profiting from it. Ask Derek to put his money where his mouth is.
Well Derek already said he was going to pledge $2 million to a lawsuit, so why don't you call him up. I know you've got him on speed dial. If your case is a slam dunk or "easy cake" as you put it, then I'm sure you'll have no problem getting it done quickly and easily. Why spend your time on the forums when you could be profiting from it. Ask Derek to put his money where his mouth is.
Derek Smart talked about a different type of case which has nothing to do with what I am saying. He still would use some of the deceptive advertising to enrich his case, but that wouldn't be his focus. He would try other stuff. Something harder to achieve or not so "easy cake", I would say.
That been said, I guess he was advised by his lawyers that, for his purposes, the lawsuit would be worthless, considering that , in one way, or another, Chris Roberts/Sandi and closest associates will win from this project, so, it's irrelevant for his purposes. Even if his lawsuit won and CIG was proven a total scam, still, Roberts/Sandi and co. would easily escape and would still profit from this venture. So, in the end, they would just laugh of he spending his money. Probably could even thank him for giving them the excuse that they probably are looking for.
That's not my purpose. So, I'd never would open a lawsuit with this objective. I realize that Roberts/Sandi and co. already profit taking advantage from people, and I know that the justice will let they, in particular, to escape, or winning. Derek's case would lead CIG to a total bankruptcy. And CR would escape with what deviated. There are ways. My case... would made CIG to pay fines, just that. Not really leading the bankruptcy or prison.
The case of deceptive advertising is totally different and yes, a case focused on that would be easy cake, leading to 1-) refunds to whoever opened the lawsuit 2-) fines for the company + the costs of leading this to a lawsuit 3-) possible damage to the company's image, since its a sensible industry and reputation matters, specially when the company is focused in a niche of hardcore gamers 4-) a powerful message to all crowdfunders so they respect their words and consumers as they should... it's not because they are free of publishers that they should treat consumers like idiots, making baits, etc.
I am not going to file it myself, because I am far from California and I am not really so motivated. I made my part in other ways and I think that are so effective as a lawsuit would be.
So I applaud all of you, keep up the publicity, we can use the increased funding you provide to the game.
--Izz
Your mistake is to think that increasing funds and the publicity that CIG is getting, at this point, do any good for the future of this project.
But according to you they aren't interested in the future anyway because there is no game. However, with all this increased coverage, their monthly pledges have increased from around $900k per month back in July to over $5 million in Novemeber. So, yes, the publicity is serving them well.
What I am finding funny about all of these arguments on the numerous threads is that those who are so venomously against this game are providing the most media coverage. Every negative post brings these threads to the surface.
So I applaud all of you, keep up the publicity, we can use the increased funding you provide to the game.
--Izz
Really? Is that so? I was under the impression that you cult-like fanboys were the ones bringing negative attention to the game, since the community is so horrible and brainwashed and everything.
Read the article but stay for the comments. If the article isn't enough to keep new people away, the comments from "community" members definitely will. It's actually pretty funny if you know about the project and how the people are, but coming from the outside not knowing everything, you guys are reeaaaaallly creepy and definitely give off that rape vibe.
So I applaud all of you, keep up the publicity, we can use the increased funding you provide to the game.
--Izz
Your mistake is to think that increasing funds and the publicity that CIG is getting, at this point, do any good for the future of this project.
But according to you they aren't interested in the future anyway because there is no game. However, with all this increased coverage, their monthly pledges have increased from around $900k per month back in July to over $5 million in Novemeber. So, yes, the publicity is serving them well.
Who are "they" that you are referring to? Not CIG, not Star Citizen, not the backers, not the crowdfunding, not the Space Sim genre, I guess.
So, if "they" are just Roberts, Sandi and a couple of closest friends working for CIG, it "could" be serving them well... because in reality, the idea that bad publicity returns you money, only works when you are not getting any publicity. But in case you are getting, the negative image causes you more harm than money, even if just looking to quick/easy money, regardless the consequences.
Roberts knows that pretty well... Have you missed his letter to The Escapist? How he overreacted to that clearly demonstrated that, in his own arguments, that the criticism has been causing harm to the wife's plan.
For all those who are interested in the crowdfunding of SC.
Looking at all that it looks almost made up. The numbers I mean. Some of it makes sense like the big rush when they 'released' certain things. But they have made almost 3 million this month along. And 600K on the day they had that disastrous live stream. Seriously you cant make stuff up like that can you? Nor can anyone with half a brain be funneling that kind of money into it? They have been getting over 100K a day for the past week or more.
At the end of last month they got 300K or more 10 straight days. They 'raised' (napkin math addition here) around 5 million from Nov 20 to Dec 1. IF those numbers are real then they surely arent hurting for cash, or shouldnt be.
So there is something positive. Or should be. IF those numbers are true and accurate then theyre are definitely making enough money to continue the project. And if they cant or claim lack of funds then they have some serious explaining to do.
So I applaud all of you, keep up the publicity, we can use the increased funding you provide to the game.
--Izz
Your mistake is to think that increasing funds and the publicity that CIG is getting, at this point, do any good for the future of this project.
But according to you they aren't interested in the future anyway because there is no game. However, with all this increased coverage, their monthly pledges have increased from around $900k per month back in July to over $5 million in Novemeber. So, yes, the publicity is serving them well.
Your statement is a strong evidence of how superficial some fans are when evaluating the results of CIG and how easily CR is able to deceive you about the results or their "success".
You are associating the bad publicity causing a grow in the backer population. Meaning that more were attracted to the cause and pledged, leading to more money. And/or that the current ones felt the need to spend more, motivated by the bad press, maybe.
First of all, there is no correlation or evidence that new backers were the ones who caused this spike, and even that old backers pledged more than usual, in relevant quantity.
What in fact happened, and its easily perceived, is that they made a lot more limited ship sales than usual in the period, and ships of high cost per individual, and in fact, considering what they released, comparing with what they released in the past vs. results of the past, if what they released or shown was really great, cleared the doubts, proven the naysayers wrong, as you guys claim or because the bad press helped, they should have attracted even more funding than attracted, a lot more than 5 million dollars.
When the only reason for the money growing is that they made more limited ship sales and more expensive ship sales, and not regularly growing to follow the progress in the game itself, which "cleared the doubts", that does not necessarily means something good for their future or even grow, my friend. It's the contrary. It means a decrease on trust, and a need to make more sales, more expensive sales, so the whales cover the gap.
When you watch the money numbers you have to think what is coming in through the front window and what could be going out the back window. Which is why a lot of people think this could all be a laundering scheme.
On the plus side you have to take into account how this will not last forever. In America if you move 10k or more the Fed's tend to start watching. Not sure about overseas and how their laws work but i wouldn't be shocked if every company involved with Roberts isn't being watched.
The day will come where something big will happen, not saying it will be bad. it could very well be good for Roberts but if you are a betting man (which it seems the backers are) my money is going to the bad side.
Which is why the term "wait for it" keeps coming up.
I want to know how they arrive at those figures. I mean 20K a day? For what? They arent selling anything but jpegs and there are no subs to pay. I can see when they offer up a few hundred ship for 2500 a pop they make their 250K or whatever but how is it so consistent? Thats why I said they look made up. I can believe they have 'raised' 102 million, what I cant believe is that most days arent 0 or close to it surrounded by a bunch of 500K days.
If Sarah Mclachlan (or Sally Struthers) saw those numbers man......
I want to know how they arrive at those figures. I mean 20K a day? For what? They arent selling anything but jpegs and there are no subs to pay. I can see when they offer up a few hundred ship for 2500 a pop they make their 250K or whatever but how is it so consistent? Thats why I said they look made up. I can believe they have 'raised' 102 million, what I cant believe is that most days arent 0 or close to it surrounded by a bunch of 500K days.
If Sarah Mclachlan (or Sally Struthers) saw those numbers man......
I raised this question long ago. It's weird and does not follow any trend of any crowdfunded campaign or game ever. It does not follow the grow in retention too, since the number of people following the project keep steady, regardless how many more people, supposedly, back the project. You can check this looking to the number of users in their forums, noticing even in general forums how they are all the same, from years ago, talking, in general obviously, their participation in livestreams, pools... all them never indicated any grow...
just that counter.
It has been said by non-confirmed sources, that they actually, had angel investors too, some of them, got their money back only recently. That talking of Roberts that dismissed them, was just an excuse to motivate more pledges. As I don't see any reason or evil agenda against Star Citizen or CIG, as the fans always see, I have the trend to believe. More on this, than in the guy that have the agenda to sell and make acceptable the sale of expensive JPEG's, and the total lack of need of commitment of developers with their promises.
The source of this money was never proven as been the backers. And they never proven or shown anything about their level of retention to the backers (you have to investigate and figure out, still, no exact numbers you get, of course), no information about the population of the game, or from who comes the money of a sale... nothing... just that counter, which follows a weird/different grow than any other of their stats that you have to research to figure out, or even when you look to other campaigns, etc. Or when you put in the formula the usual feedback that this game have, always more negative than positive and how long yet, and clearly, will take to be finished.
Their only marketing attitude, overreaction to some issues, tell you a different story than their counter.
Their reaction is telling. How they appeal to the most of the silly arguments, to deny to show the things to the public. That is all, like confession to me.
Their reality is ridiculously different from what that counter wants to tell you. I am sure of that, after 3 years looking into this. And I dare them to prove me wrong. They could. In a matter of one or two minutes. Would end all the doubts raised or most of them... But they won't... You have to ask yourself why? (and so far, their explanations for the why were simply pathetic and more silly than any fan argument). At this point, with the doubt spread over all the game industry, including press, etc., they wouldn't need to wait for the "game" to answer. That does not make any sense. They lose with that. They would just prove the doubts wrong, showing more meaningful data. Or accepting a thirdy party, independent to present that. It's common practice. There is nothing "alien" on this. Under the circumstances, CIG would win with that... except if they are not telling the true
And they aren't. Would be shocking to people, press, if they figured out that in fact, CIG have less than 300k backers, just to start. They would be damned and accused not just by some people, but by everyone as doing false advertising, including press, because that IS false advertising. The main media press wouldn't have any doubt on put this in the headlines. So, these are the reason why they treat this subject as heresy and a sin, for any backer to dare to ask or talk about it.
For all those who are interested in the crowdfunding of SC.
Looking at all that it looks almost made up. The numbers I mean. Some of it makes sense like the big rush when they 'released' certain things. But they have made almost 3 million this month along. And 600K on the day they had that disastrous live stream. Seriously you cant make stuff up like that can you? Nor can anyone with half a brain be funneling that kind of money into it? They have been getting over 100K a day for the past week or more.
At the end of last month they got 300K or more 10 straight days. They 'raised' (napkin math addition here) around 5 million from Nov 20 to Dec 1. IF those numbers are real then they surely arent hurting for cash, or shouldnt be.
So there is something positive. Or should be. IF those numbers are true and accurate then theyre are definitely making enough money to continue the project. And if they cant or claim lack of funds then they have some serious explaining to do.
You forget that there are not only the whales and cult members that buy anything, there are also a huge number of speculators that buy limited ships to sell on the grey market ships. This grey market is where most of these ships are waiting for whales to snatch them up because they are rare.
"It's pretty simple, really. If your only intention in posting about a particular game or topic is to be negative, then yes, you should probably move on. Voicing a negative opinion is fine, continually doing so on the same game is basically just trolling." - Michael Bitton Community Manager, MMORPG.com
"As an online discussion about Star Citizen grows longer, the probability of a comparison involving Derek Smart approaches 1" - MrSnuffles's law
"I am jumping in here a bit without knowing exactly what you all or talking about." - SEANMCAD
You forget that there are not only the whales and cult members that buy anything, there are also a huge number of speculators that buy limited ships to sell on the grey market ships. This grey market is where most of these ships are waiting for whales to snatch them up because they are rare.
The true is always in the details. Like that sale of packages by a low price (marking one of their past offers as another instance of deceptive advertising, by the way), that ended sold in huge majority, and confirmed even by Lesnick, to current backers. Of course, painting the scenario with a lame excuse: "Oh, because the backers will gift their friends"
If they had this grow that people want to believe in number of backers, this natural grow that challenges the logic and the reality of the market, which works in one way to Roberts and in a different way to everyone else, they wouldn't push so high the regular limited ship sales, and specially by the ship prices that they sell them.
Some people are just passionate enough to use their brains.
They need "links" for everything.
By the way, I am not condemning this attitude, and that's why I backed up my statements when is necessary (when they are not just proven by simple logic and even when some guys decide to close their eyes), but its just hilarious/ironic, because If they had the same kind of attitude with Roberts, asking the proof to Roberts back up his own statements or claims, probably this project would be in a much better path at this point with no harm or so many doubts raised.
And in fact, just like the logic of the market works differently for Roberts, the logic is also the opposite, when its a matter to defend Roberts, so when someone ask this for Roberts, their answer is that he shouldn't "share the links" if you know what I mean. Must be an evil hater who wants to troll or destroy the project. How dare you to question the honesty of the guy (meanwhile, they question the honesty of everyone else, from general public, to the press)
Comments
I think that you're confusing the meaning of "proving" and "saying nothing". You talk an awful lot, but say nothing. Even yesterday you were asked for a link to back up your claims and you gave nothing. You link stuff about laws surrounding deception, but then go on to make the assumption that CIG is being intentionally deceptive. So even the things that you link are contextually irrelevant.
I'm still not getting your point. You just linked to something that specifically states that people who backed before $6 million will get it free. Also, Behind Enemy Lines is the SECOND episode of S42, not the first. Every backer gets the first episode of S42 for free. It's about 20 hours of gameplay, and that's straight from the mouth of CR himself.
I'm so happy that you proved me wrong once again, though. Please, feel free to find some more unsupported data or wildly speculative information that I can shoot down with a straw and some chewed up paper.
/sarcasm
Crazkanuk
----------------
Azarelos - 90 Hunter - Emerald
Durnzig - 90 Paladin - Emerald
Demonicron - 90 Death Knight - Emerald Dream - US
Tankinpain - 90 Monk - Azjol-Nerub - US
Brindell - 90 Warrior - Emerald Dream - US
----------------
1-) The link that you persisted should be about a cost of 150 million dollars for the trilogy. A number which is irrelevant to the point that I raised. It could be 100, 50, 1 billion, it was irrelevant to my point, how exact would be that number. That is what you were asking for. But that was not my point in that discussion. So you twisted my point and tried to focus in something that was out of the context of the discussion and the point raised. You went to the point of saying that "it wouldn't matter" even if I provided such link... because blablabla, taking conclusions that had nothing to do with what I am saying. And I tried to reply more than one time, explaining what I was saying. You purposefully ignored.
2-) My link of FTC was about the deceptive advertising in legal perspective, since people confuse "deceptive advertising", which is a matter of a law, with the meaning of the word "deception". In the explanation, becomes clear that there is no "intention" required to be proven, so a company be guilty of doing deceptive advertising. Because its their legal obligation to use the techniques to do not make ambiguous, misleading offers, or omit important information, that if not omitted, would make consumers do not buy/pledge. You twisted totally what was said and went to the point of saying that was needed intention proven, or a court would dismiss, which just shown your absolute lack of comprehension about the clear statements of FTC, that you just want to refuse to understand. So, your comprehension is getting everything in the opposite of what that means. Then, I went in a discussion with other user, not you, to prove the point that, regardless not needed, legally, to prove intention so CIG be guilty of deceptive advertising, of breaking this law, STILL, is possible to prove them been deceptive intentionally (unnecessary, but its possible). But you are so easily confused due your lack of comprehension and knowledge about the law, even when the authority statements try to clarify to you, which I guess, has been caused by your fanaticism for Star Citizen, the denial, so it's not really possible to clarify anything for you, because you are just with your twisted mind, fighting a "war" against the "evil" who "want to destroy Star Citizen". It's all in your mind and in the mind of other cultists.
But don't worry. Everyone else, without the fanaticism of a fan, understood my point, according with some private messages that I received.
3-) I didn't say that BEL is the first episode. It's indeed the second. And there is a third, unnamed. The point, which I am going to repeat for the third time, is that people already paid for them. Chris Roberts stated, that with the funds raised, while ago, they expanded Squadron 42 to become a trilogy. The first episode was expanded. The second and third were expanded. All they were expanded, BECAUSE, people who pledged AFTER the 6 million mark, pledged more money... exponentially more, I mean... almost 17 times more. Still, all these people will have to pay for a copy of those campaigns. Which is ridiculous, from a consumer point of view and that was the point of the conversation that I was having, not with you, but with other person.
4-) "Please, feel free to find some more unsupported data"... yeah... a FTC statement, the organization which regulates the matter in United States: "Unsupported data... wildly speculative information"
1) YOU GAVE THE LINK!!! Not only that but you quoted from it! It had nothing to do with $150 million.
2) Lol, again, you lean on fanboyism as an explanation for why someone refutes evidence that you bring up. Honestly, truthfully, please prove something, anything. I really wish you would. If you could prove something about this game and put it to bed then I wouldn't have to argue with you. It's not about being a fanboy or a white knight, it's about being factual and correct, neither of which you seem to be able to accomplish. Yes, there are laws about deceptive marketing. If you are THAT convinced about their deceptive practices then launch a lawsuit yourself. Based on what you're saying it's a slam dunk!
3) Where does it say that people paid for this trilogy? You LITERALLY gave a link that said that everyone up until the $6 million mark would get up to BEL for free. We are over $100 million in. This stretch goal was set at the $6 million mark. How much earlier could this have been set? That expectation was set literally over 3 years ago (11/12/2012). I can appreciate if you feel like the model of paying for episodic content is ridiculous, but just say that. Don't claim it's deceptive. You know what, if you don't like that model, you don't have to buy it, or buy the game at all for that matter.
4) I never disputed that the FTC statement was not accurate, but it's completely irrelevant. You're claiming that CIG is being intentionally deceptive, and then link to a definition of what that is as evidence. See, again, you seem to have a misunderstanding of what "proof" is. You should google it.
Crazkanuk
----------------
Azarelos - 90 Hunter - Emerald
Durnzig - 90 Paladin - Emerald
Demonicron - 90 Death Knight - Emerald Dream - US
Tankinpain - 90 Monk - Azjol-Nerub - US
Brindell - 90 Warrior - Emerald Dream - US
----------------
2) "It's not about being a fanboy or a white knight, it's about being factual and correct"
Yes. That's what i did. You failed to see because your mind is twisted, clouded by your passion.
3) Where does it say that people paid for this trilogy?
"We are over $100 million in. This stretch goal was set at the $6 million mark."
You answered your own question.
4) "I never disputed that the FTC statement was not accurate, but it's completely irrelevant."
Wait. What? First you asked me to be factual and correct. And if I am factual and correct, you say that it's completely irrelevant. Ok pal. I cant win from this
"You're claiming that CIG is being intentionally deceptive"
Not in the way that you claimed. I claimed that CIG was deceptive first. And then I claimed that, regardless not needed, its possible to prove they been deceptive "intentionally". And for that, I had a conversation with other guy which I presented all the points that you are asking for. He also used your same tactic. Of twisting the conversation and ignoring the arguments, focusing in one thing that out of scope, didn't mean what I was saying.
One of these points is that CIG changed a clause of their own TOS to expand a time where they should give the refunds to people. This is been intentionally deceptive, because first, they made a clause that was supposed to work as a warranty to people who pledged... then, they removed that warranty, and made people obligated to accept that, or, wouldn't have the ability to play what they paid for and were warranted previously. That is pretty much, irrefutable proof of been intentionally deceptive. Once again, and to be clear, totally unnecessary if we were disputing this in a lawsuit. In a lawsuit just would stay the fact that the clause is deceptive, regardless stories of how that happened or excuses that could be given. It's deceptive. Period. Excuses don't matter, because the company failed in its legal responsibility. Lets calculate the fines. Pretty much that is what would happen, legally. But, I just pointed this to show how far they go and how not reliable they are, because its not accident. They are intentionally shady.
And I gave other examples too. Like Roberts intentionally denying to people that the game, with expanded scope would cause delays (feature creep), and later, he saying that "was obvious that would take longer". So, why he denied that and tried to claim that people who thought that would be obvious that would take longer, were wrong, and he had everything covered? He knew that was obvious. But was convenient to deny in that time, when he was looking for 20 million dollars. He was intentionally deceptive here, and its proven by the own contradiction of his statements.
So, "google it" in case you are unable to go back a few pages and read, without putting your passion and hate and obsession to advertise this game, to cloud your ability to analyse what is said.
For all those who are interested in the crowdfunding of SC.
- Albert Einstein
Ok, I can probably have a more coherent argument with my 8 year-old, and he'd probably give more proof too. I honestly can't make out a single sentence that you're saying. I don't even know what the hell you're arguing. I guess I'm a fanboy and you've managed to prove all of your points with subjective information.
You claimed to be a lawyer at one time. Do you really believe that the case you've presented would stand up in court?
Crazkanuk
----------------
Azarelos - 90 Hunter - Emerald
Durnzig - 90 Paladin - Emerald
Demonicron - 90 Death Knight - Emerald Dream - US
Tankinpain - 90 Monk - Azjol-Nerub - US
Brindell - 90 Warrior - Emerald Dream - US
----------------
Then you have those who are interested to see all the drama, a curiosity is sparked, to see if there is any truth to positive or negative allegations. People then decide based on their own investigation what is going on. And some of those people decide to back the game.
So I applaud all of you, keep up the publicity, we can use the increased funding you provide to the game.
--Izz
In fact, their biggest issue for the future of Star Citizen lies outside of the court. They don't need a court to ruin them. They are ruining themselves, just to make the "wife's plan" work in the moment... ignoring the effects... they are been irresponsible and short-sighted... and I already explained all that in details in other post, so "google it" if you are interested.
I also tried to help them giving a feedback to Sandi/Roberts/Lesnick regarding how the community was becoming toxic and how that, in the medium/long term would impact CIG negativelly, working more against them instead in favor of them and how their polices and attitude were just encouraging something that would become a real problem... I guess I was vindicated about this already, since all the press outlets already wrote in agreement or with tips of ironies about that.
Interesting that its the main reason that made Sandi/Roberts hating me so much (per the own Sandi's answer to me in the past, plus, of course, how angry she become when I gave a feedback praising another girl, instead her, assuming that praising another girl by his good service provide meant that "I was fobbing her" - she said), to the point of doing what they did (or probably Sandi did and the other guys just came to help and make the damage control), in my particular case, which was a true shame for them and they try their best to hide.
"A waste of her and CEO's time" - she said. I invite her to publicize that email and let's all see what was that feedback that was ignored was about, and if it was really reasonable to consider "a waste of time", considering how many issues could be avoided if they worked to solve the gaps that I pointed ealier 2013
Unfortunately, those people have more ego than professionalism.
Crazkanuk
----------------
Azarelos - 90 Hunter - Emerald
Durnzig - 90 Paladin - Emerald
Demonicron - 90 Death Knight - Emerald Dream - US
Tankinpain - 90 Monk - Azjol-Nerub - US
Brindell - 90 Warrior - Emerald Dream - US
----------------
That been said, I guess he was advised by his lawyers that, for his purposes, the lawsuit would be worthless, considering that , in one way, or another, Chris Roberts/Sandi and closest associates will win from this project, so, it's irrelevant for his purposes. Even if his lawsuit won and CIG was proven a total scam, still, Roberts/Sandi and co. would easily escape and would still profit from this venture. So, in the end, they would just laugh of he spending his money. Probably could even thank him for giving them the excuse that they probably are looking for.
That's not my purpose. So, I'd never would open a lawsuit with this objective. I realize that Roberts/Sandi and co. already profit taking advantage from people, and I know that the justice will let they, in particular, to escape, or winning. Derek's case would lead CIG to a total bankruptcy. And CR would escape with what deviated. There are ways. My case... would made CIG to pay fines, just that. Not really leading the bankruptcy or prison.
The case of deceptive advertising is totally different and yes, a case focused on that would be easy cake, leading to 1-) refunds to whoever opened the lawsuit 2-) fines for the company + the costs of leading this to a lawsuit 3-) possible damage to the company's image, since its a sensible industry and reputation matters, specially when the company is focused in a niche of hardcore gamers 4-) a powerful message to all crowdfunders so they respect their words and consumers as they should... it's not because they are free of publishers that they should treat consumers like idiots, making baits, etc.
I am not going to file it myself, because I am far from California and I am not really so motivated. I made my part in other ways and I think that are so effective as a lawsuit would be.
Crazkanuk
----------------
Azarelos - 90 Hunter - Emerald
Durnzig - 90 Paladin - Emerald
Demonicron - 90 Death Knight - Emerald Dream - US
Tankinpain - 90 Monk - Azjol-Nerub - US
Brindell - 90 Warrior - Emerald Dream - US
----------------
So, if "they" are just Roberts, Sandi and a couple of closest friends working for CIG, it "could" be serving them well... because in reality, the idea that bad publicity returns you money, only works when you are not getting any publicity. But in case you are getting, the negative image causes you more harm than money, even if just looking to quick/easy money, regardless the consequences.
Roberts knows that pretty well... Have you missed his letter to The Escapist? How he overreacted to that clearly demonstrated that, in his own arguments, that the criticism has been causing harm to the wife's plan.
At the end of last month they got 300K or more 10 straight days. They 'raised' (napkin math addition here) around 5 million from Nov 20 to Dec 1. IF those numbers are real then they surely arent hurting for cash, or shouldnt be.
So there is something positive. Or should be. IF those numbers are true and accurate then theyre are definitely making enough money to continue the project. And if they cant or claim lack of funds then they have some serious explaining to do.
You are associating the bad publicity causing a grow in the backer population. Meaning that more were attracted to the cause and pledged, leading to more money. And/or that the current ones felt the need to spend more, motivated by the bad press, maybe.
First of all, there is no correlation or evidence that new backers were the ones who caused this spike, and even that old backers pledged more than usual, in relevant quantity.
What in fact happened, and its easily perceived, is that they made a lot more limited ship sales than usual in the period, and ships of high cost per individual, and in fact, considering what they released, comparing with what they released in the past vs. results of the past, if what they released or shown was really great, cleared the doubts, proven the naysayers wrong, as you guys claim or because the bad press helped, they should have attracted even more funding than attracted, a lot more than 5 million dollars.
When the only reason for the money growing is that they made more limited ship sales and more expensive ship sales, and not regularly growing to follow the progress in the game itself, which "cleared the doubts", that does not necessarily means something good for their future or even grow, my friend. It's the contrary. It means a decrease on trust, and a need to make more sales, more expensive sales, so the whales cover the gap.
On the plus side you have to take into account how this will not last forever. In America if you move 10k or more the Fed's tend to start watching. Not sure about overseas and how their laws work but i wouldn't be shocked if every company involved with Roberts isn't being watched.
The day will come where something big will happen, not saying it will be bad. it could very well be good for Roberts but if you are a betting man (which it seems the backers are) my money is going to the bad side.
Which is why the term "wait for it" keeps coming up.
Star Citizen – The Extinction Level Event
4/13/15 > ELE has been updated look for 16-04-13.
http://www.dereksmart.org/2016/04/star-citizen-the-ele/
Enjoy and know the truth always comes to light!
If Sarah Mclachlan (or Sally Struthers) saw those numbers man......
Star Citizen – The Extinction Level Event
4/13/15 > ELE has been updated look for 16-04-13.
http://www.dereksmart.org/2016/04/star-citizen-the-ele/
Enjoy and know the truth always comes to light!
just that counter.
It has been said by non-confirmed sources, that they actually, had angel investors too, some of them, got their money back only recently. That talking of Roberts that dismissed them, was just an excuse to motivate more pledges. As I don't see any reason or evil agenda against Star Citizen or CIG, as the fans always see, I have the trend to believe. More on this, than in the guy that have the agenda to sell and make acceptable the sale of expensive JPEG's, and the total lack of need of commitment of developers with their promises.
The source of this money was never proven as been the backers. And they never proven or shown anything about their level of retention to the backers (you have to investigate and figure out, still, no exact numbers you get, of course), no information about the population of the game, or from who comes the money of a sale... nothing... just that counter, which follows a weird/different grow than any other of their stats that you have to research to figure out, or even when you look to other campaigns, etc. Or when you put in the formula the usual feedback that this game have, always more negative than positive and how long yet, and clearly, will take to be finished.
Their only marketing attitude, overreaction to some issues, tell you a different story than their counter.
Their reaction is telling. How they appeal to the most of the silly arguments, to deny to show the things to the public. That is all, like confession to me.
Their reality is ridiculously different from what that counter wants to tell you. I am sure of that, after 3 years looking into this. And I dare them to prove me wrong. They could. In a matter of one or two minutes. Would end all the doubts raised or most of them... But they won't... You have to ask yourself why? (and so far, their explanations for the why were simply pathetic and more silly than any fan argument). At this point, with the doubt spread over all the game industry, including press, etc., they wouldn't need to wait for the "game" to answer. That does not make any sense. They lose with that. They would just prove the doubts wrong, showing more meaningful data. Or accepting a thirdy party, independent to present that. It's common practice. There is nothing "alien" on this. Under the circumstances, CIG would win with that... except if they are not telling the true
And they aren't. Would be shocking to people, press, if they figured out that in fact, CIG have less than 300k backers, just to start. They would be damned and accused not just by some people, but by everyone as doing false advertising, including press, because that IS false advertising. The main media press wouldn't have any doubt on put this in the headlines. So, these are the reason why they treat this subject as heresy and a sin, for any backer to dare to ask or talk about it.
You wrote that they are banning backers for talking bad about SC on other boards.
Link us the relevant info. Show us.
"It's pretty simple, really. If your only intention in posting about a particular game or topic is to be negative, then yes, you should probably move on. Voicing a negative opinion is fine, continually doing so on the same game is basically just trolling."
- Michael Bitton
Community Manager, MMORPG.com
"As an online discussion about Star Citizen grows longer, the probability of a comparison involving Derek Smart approaches 1" - MrSnuffles's law
"I am jumping in here a bit without knowing exactly what you all or talking about."
- SEANMCAD
▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬
If they had this grow that people want to believe in number of backers, this natural grow that challenges the logic and the reality of the market, which works in one way to Roberts and in a different way to everyone else, they wouldn't push so high the regular limited ship sales, and specially by the ship prices that they sell them.
Some people are just passionate enough to use their brains.
They need "links" for everything.
By the way, I am not condemning this attitude, and that's why I backed up my statements when is necessary (when they are not just proven by simple logic and even when some guys decide to close their eyes), but its just hilarious/ironic, because If they had the same kind of attitude with Roberts, asking the proof to Roberts back up his own statements or claims, probably this project would be in a much better path at this point with no harm or so many doubts raised.
And in fact, just like the logic of the market works differently for Roberts, the logic is also the opposite, when its a matter to defend Roberts, so when someone ask this for Roberts, their answer is that he shouldn't "share the links" if you know what I mean. Must be an evil hater who wants to troll or destroy the project. How dare you to question the honesty of the guy (meanwhile, they question the honesty of everyone else, from general public, to the press)