Going by what you originally said is wrong. You made it sound like the poll was already taken. I think that is the whole problem on both sides. People keep making statements when they clearly have nothing to back it up.
It's also like the poll I read Chris Roberts took and said majority of backers agreed to extend the game with amazing additions that are (what I have read) not in game yet.
The poll was for the continuity of stretch goals overall, not specifically implying anything over it.
Anyway my claim as you asked, was that i was just making the claim out of hot air, so i created the poll. I made the claim before it because i do belong as any other backer to this community and on a topic that has been discussed countless times and beaten up do death it's not hard to get to the conclusion of the overall feelings of the community towards it. Unlike SM, the topics that backers are really bothered with are things like HOTA's & controller balance.
Also on Chris Roberts being a genius or an idiot, why not human? I'm not sure why we have to play on everything by extremes, or SC is the best game ever or it's the worse game ever, can't it be just a good game? At least that's what i want from it.
Just a good game isn't what was promised and sold up
IDK why you cannot see that most of the people who would vote Yes are already gone from the forums. The poll is biased because you have placed it in the middle of the people who keep drinking and loving that koolaid. You act like they don't ban people who disagree with CIG on the forums. Which is why noone is able to ask the question about the 5 weeks and noone has gotten an answer. Because asking such a question would get the thread deleted and the account banned.
You really haven't been on the forums recently have you? That post you just made proves it for me, harsh criticism towards CIG, sharing and discussion concerns is something that is clearly not missing in there, the problem lies on ridiculously aggressive behavior of people towards each other because they can't agree on something.
Feel free to go there and ask the question, however on my side i won't blame the backers for not wanting to keep beating up the dead horse on more threads about the same pointless speculation. People are tired of it.
I hope I do too, I haven't be checking the forums as much as I used to over the last 3 months, only this week as stuck in bed, but there's nothing new, no updates of ship fixes, just talk about new concept ship sales and FPS additions.
I have to ask....
...WHERE'S THE WING COMMANDER, PRIVATEER AND FREELANCER ASPECT IN STAR CITIZEN?
As of this moment, I see next to nothing that even comes close to those games.
Ok just looking through your thread and seeing that a lot of the backers don't even care about Star Marine at all. Then there's this guy.
The forum users in CIG so scared of getting banned for saying the wrong thing.
Side of the kinda trollish behavior he kinda gave me the impression of...
...He was directly baiting the moderators by doing that comment "Shhhhh you'll get a life ban for that". Don't tell me he is afraid of being banned at the same time making comments that will definitively bait a moderator who sees it to act. :P
Here is the forum to post the concern questions/discussions, btw best read the actual rules before, things as calling out by name individual employees on threads like that will not end up well.
I already disproved it. Using 0.00008% of the community is not a representative number and for you to claim the majority aren't bothered by it is laughable. If you came in here with statistics that would mean anything then I would agree with you provided they support your claim. As it stands right now it's like you took 3 people, saw 1 is a man and 2 are women's and declared that the world population is 33.3% men and 66.6% women.
It's not really a desperate attempt on my part when you throw up piss poor numbers and declare that you're right.
I refuse it because you're being bias even on logic here.
You know what polls are? They are made from small fractions from the whole to determine the outcome, they are usually decently representative of the global. You're completely ignoring this.
If you reach up the SC's Backer community and do a poll to get the overall opinion. The same way the poll that asked the community if they should do more Stretch Goals was done, only part of the community gave their input.
You're actually telling me I'm being illogical when you are trying to pass off a poll with a almost nonexistent sample size as being the majority of backers?
I do know what polls are but you seem to be wanting your cake and eat it too. You're choosing just the SC community where there is a clear bias and yet you tell me I'm the one being bias?
I already disproved it. Using 0.00008% of the community is not a representative number and for you to claim the majority aren't bothered by it is laughable. If you came in here with statistics that would mean anything then I would agree with you provided they support your claim. As it stands right now it's like you took 3 people, saw 1 is a man and 2 are women's and declared that the world population is 33.3% men and 66.6% women.
It's not really a desperate attempt on my part when you throw up piss poor numbers and declare that you're right.
I refuse it because you're being bias even on logic here.
You know what polls are? They are made from small fractions from the whole to determine the outcome, they are usually decently representative of the global. You're completely ignoring this.
If you reach up the SC's Backer community and do a poll to get the overall opinion. The same way the poll that asked the community if they should do more Stretch Goals was done, only part of the community gave their input.
You're actually telling me I'm being illogical when you are trying to pass off a poll with a almost nonexistent sample size as being the majority of backers?
I do know what polls are but you seem to be wanting your cake and eat it too. You're choosing just the SC community where there is a clear bias and yet you tell me I'm the one being bias?
So where exactly can a poll be run that can be answered by all SC backers without any bias? Anyone who has signed up for CIG's website can vote in the poll. Whether they are active or not.
Yes, please do. Also, don't forget to charge back any purchase that you're unhappy with. In the end, it goes towards improving society and improving honesty and fairness.
Maybe in Canada you have to bend over and take it in the ass, and you are used to that, but in the US, pre-release software can ALWAYS be charged back. It is by definition, an incomplete product.
And lol at "honesty and fairness", honesty and fairness is doing what you say, when you say you will. SC is how long past its supposed release date? That alone is enough for chargeback, as is missing features that were advertised, of which there are several at this point.
So, charging back in regards to SC is fully legitimate at this point, no matter how much you boosters wish it was not.
That's why I am encouraging it. Nobody should take it in the ass, which is why I think people should chargeback whatever they aren't happy with. I mean plenty of experts on here who clearly have more knowledge and experience on the topic have acknowledged that there are no negative consequences that could come from it.
You are absolutely correct: under every CC agreement I have seen in the US, a customer is allowed to request a chargeback for an incomplete product.
By definition, pre-release software is an incomplete product.
SC is an incomplete product.
As such SC can be legitimately charged back with no negative consequences whatsoever, despite your snark.
I already disproved it. Using 0.00008% of the community is not a representative number and for you to claim the majority aren't bothered by it is laughable. If you came in here with statistics that would mean anything then I would agree with you provided they support your claim. As it stands right now it's like you took 3 people, saw 1 is a man and 2 are women's and declared that the world population is 33.3% men and 66.6% women.
It's not really a desperate attempt on my part when you throw up piss poor numbers and declare that you're right.
I refuse it because you're being bias even on logic here.
You know what polls are? They are made from small fractions from the whole to determine the outcome, they are usually decently representative of the global. You're completely ignoring this.
If you reach up the SC's Backer community and do a poll to get the overall opinion. The same way the poll that asked the community if they should do more Stretch Goals was done, only part of the community gave their input.
You're actually telling me I'm being illogical when you are trying to pass off a poll with a almost nonexistent sample size as being the majority of backers?
I do know what polls are but you seem to be wanting your cake and eat it too. You're choosing just the SC community where there is a clear bias and yet you tell me I'm the one being bias?
So where exactly can a poll be run that can be answered by all SC backers without any bias? Anyone who has signed up for CIG's website can vote in the poll. Whether they are active or not.
You will never get all SC backers unfortunately. Anyone who has signed up on CIG's website can vote yes but it seems only a very active minority has a presence there and they lean very heavily towards a certain bias about the game.
Yes, please do. Also, don't forget to charge back any purchase that you're unhappy with. In the end, it goes towards improving society and improving honesty and fairness.
Maybe in Canada you have to bend over and take it in the ass, and you are used to that, but in the US, pre-release software can ALWAYS be charged back. It is by definition, an incomplete product.
And lol at "honesty and fairness", honesty and fairness is doing what you say, when you say you will. SC is how long past its supposed release date? That alone is enough for chargeback, as is missing features that were advertised, of which there are several at this point.
So, charging back in regards to SC is fully legitimate at this point, no matter how much you boosters wish it was not.
That's why I am encouraging it. Nobody should take it in the ass, which is why I think people should chargeback whatever they aren't happy with. I mean plenty of experts on here who clearly have more knowledge and experience on the topic have acknowledged that there are no negative consequences that could come from it.
You are absolutely correct: under every CC agreement I have seen in the US, a customer is allowed to request a chargeback for an incomplete product.
By definition, pre-release software is an incomplete product.
SC is an incomplete product.
As such SC can be legitimately charged back with no negative consequences whatsoever, despite your snark.
If you believe the rumors then apparently CIG is trying to pass on their chargeback fees to the person doing the chargeback
The worst part about the poll isn't that there are only 69 people responding, it's that it isn't a legitimate random sampling. Taking that poll from the SC forums is like taking a poll about who believes in God from a Mormon church.
Up the pace a bit.... got only 7 more days to rehash that year old "news". ;-)
Have fun
If the past is any indicator, the next two conventions will give us plenty of promises and gaffs to stretch for the next year.
You know that Chris is going to get going on something and put his foot in his mouth. He can't help it.
Still doesn't excuse the fact that the man said 3-5 weeks. Over 14 months ago. Then filled it with a bunch of bullcrap and swept it under the rug. The entire point in this thread was to find out why Chris would make such a claim which was clearly showing he is full of his own shit. Making up stuff and feeding backers all kinds of spins and lots of them love him for it but there is also a lot of backers who can see through it. Its way too late to make this look good for them. Its just a box for people to shoot each other in. Its not some great accomplishment.
Yes, clearly, if a developer expects to release something in 3-5 weeks based on current information and the current plan - then it's a spin and a lie to talk about it openly - when you're obligated to an open development process.
Not delivering on time due to significant plan changes is clearly a crime - and he should be punished severely.
Conclusively, what some of the more unreasonable detractors want is no change of plans for a game in full development - or that developers never mention their plans in public, for fear of missing an ETA. What does the E stand for again?
I find such demands quite amusing - not to mention as far away from reality as you could possibly get.
That's the kind of expectation you would have if you were a child - or a psychotic boss with zero understanding or empathy for how reality might actually get in the way of plans.
The worst part about the poll isn't that there are only 69 people responding, it's that it isn't a legitimate random sampling. Taking that poll from the SC forums is like taking a poll about who believes in God from a Mormon church.
Neh, for me the worst part is everybody desperatly attacking the poll, yet not going towards any facts or proof to counter the claim i made even before that poll. It was made on the ONLY place all the backers of this game are registered and the that's who it was meant for, not for random people on random internet forums.
The poll that took the decision of the continuity of stretch goals back then, was also done on the site and only got replied by a fraction of the total backers, yet the majority of who voted still took the decision. You can argue all day "oh but not all the backers voted so it doesn't count" but it definitively did.
So i stand to my claim, that the majority of the backers of SC do not care about SM delays and the fact that it is still un-released. Specially not after the FPS dev being done with and within the PU dev on the main Alpha.
The worst part about the poll isn't that there are only 69 people responding, it's that it isn't a legitimate random sampling. Taking that poll from the SC forums is like taking a poll about who believes in God from a Mormon church.
Neh, for me the worst part is everybody desperatly attacking the poll, yet not going towards any facts or proof to counter the claim i made even before that poll. It was made on the ONLY place all the backers of this game are registered and the that's who it was meant for, not for random people on random internet forums.
The poll that took the decision of the continuity of stretch goals back then, was also done on the site and only got replied by a fraction of the total backers, yet the majority of who voted still took the decision. You can argue all day "oh but not all the backers voted so it doesn't count" but it definitively did.
So i stand to my claim, that the majority of the backers of SC do not care about SM delays and the fact that it is still un-released. Specially not after the FPS dev being done with and within the PU dev on the main Alpha.
No one who is informed and reasonable would want CIG to focus on SM development over the SC alpha, when the asset quality-level was clearly not at the expected standard. If Chris/CIG made a mistake - and they've made plenty, as they're human - it's that they should never have hired an external developer for the job - but at least they cut their losses and made the right call in the end. 20-20 hindsight and all that.
Many developers subject to a publisher green-light would never have been able to do that.
That's one of the best parts of SC development. The ability to change plans and improve the core of the experience - even if it takes longer and is more expensive. Most publishers are just like the detractors: they want results NOW - and they have no surplus of patience or tolerance for plans changing. They're basically children - wanting a return on their investment in the shorter term, no matter the outcome or long term result.
That some people believe CIG can't do basic math and that they don't have the money to do what they're planning - is only worthy of note if there's evidence to support such a negative claim. There isn't - and there never has been. Nothing but total speculation.
Is it possible that CIG don't know that 2+2 = 4? Sure it is, but I don't want to entertain such nonsense unless there's a tangible reason.
The worst part about the poll isn't that there are only 69 people responding, it's that it isn't a legitimate random sampling. Taking that poll from the SC forums is like taking a poll about who believes in God from a Mormon church.
Neh, for me the worst part is everybody desperatly attacking the poll, yet not going towards any facts or proof to counter the claim i made even before that poll. It was made on the ONLY place all the backers of this game are registered and the that's who it was meant for, not for random people on random internet forums.
The poll that took the decision of the continuity of stretch goals back then, was also done on the site and only got replied by a fraction of the total backers, yet the majority of who voted still took the decision. You can argue all day "oh but not all the backers voted so it doesn't count" but it definitively did.
So i stand to my claim, that the majority of the backers of SC do not care about SM delays and the fact that it is still un-released. Specially not after the FPS dev being done with and within the PU dev on the main Alpha.
You can stand by your claim, but no one will take it seriously if you use bunk data to support it.
Well I give up. The man lied then spun a bunch of more lies to cover it up. And only people who take the time to think about the lies will actually see they are in fact lies. Its what he has been doing since the first day. Reminds me of the biggest pvp guild EP in ESO right now. The leader lies to everyone and fills up the ranks with tons of players. It is successful but at the same time the leader himself is just a joke who keeps lying and scamming everyone.
Well I give up. The man lied then spun a bunch of more lies to cover it up. And only people who take the time to think about the lies will actually see they are in fact lies. Its what he has been doing since the first day. Reminds me of the biggest pvp guild EP in ESO right now. The leader lies to everyone and fills up the ranks with tons of players. It is successful but at the same time the leader himself is just a joke who keeps lying and scamming everyone.
Yes yes, it's all a conspiracy full of liars and evil wizards. Only people who "understand the world" will agree with you
No one who is informed and reasonable would want CIG to focus on SM development over the SC alpha, when the asset quality-level was clearly not at the expected standard. If Chris/CIG made a mistake - and they've made plenty, as they're human
Yeah exactly this, with the FPS being developed upon the alpha releases, well at least up until now with 2.6 already targeting SM, we could see by ourselves that the FPS mechanic of the game is there, but it's not finished. The interest for SM completely felt with they updating the PU with FPS improvements, some new features and new weapons pretty much every alpha release.
I see SM as a cool feature but i'd trade it any day for more gameplay features on the PU alpha. There's little point unless CIG wants to risk another storm of backlash on releasing SM without the quality level and features the players expect.
The worst part about the poll isn't that there are only 69 people responding, it's that it isn't a legitimate random sampling. Taking that poll from the SC forums is like taking a poll about who believes in God from a Mormon church.
Neh, for me the worst part is everybody desperatly attacking the poll, yet not going towards any facts or proof to counter the claim i made even before that poll. It was made on the ONLY place all the backers of this game are registered and the that's who it was meant for, not for random people on random internet forums.
The poll that took the decision of the continuity of stretch goals back then, was also done on the site and only got replied by a fraction of the total backers, yet the majority of who voted still took the decision. You can argue all day "oh but not all the backers voted so it doesn't count" but it definitively did.
So i stand to my claim, that the majority of the backers of SC do not care about SM delays and the fact that it is still un-released. Specially not after the FPS dev being done with and within the PU dev on the main Alpha.
You can stand by your claim, but no one will take it seriously if you use bunk data to support it.
What I can't take seriously are the people unable to accept the simplest and most likely explanation - that's been stated in public by the developers involved over and over - who would rather conjure up complete nonsense to support an irrational campaign against a potentially great game.
You can stand by your claim, but no one will take it seriously if you use bunk data to support it.
Yes i shall stand to it, i did it before, knowing and lurking the community, reddit, rsi's discord up to in-game, the same feelings of backers on this matter are overall the same as mine. It's just what it is.
So let's take seriously instead, random people saying random things on the internet! Well if it fits the bias, why the hell not?!
No one who is informed and reasonable would want CIG to focus on SM development over the SC alpha, when the asset quality-level was clearly not at the expected standard. If Chris/CIG made a mistake - and they've made plenty, as they're human
Yeah exactly this, with the FPS being developed upon the alpha releases, well at least up until now with 2.6 already targeting SM, we could see by ourselves that the FPS mechanic of the game is there, but it's not finished. The interest for SM completely felt with they updating the PU with FPS improvements, some new features and new weapons pretty much every alpha release.
I see SM as a cool feature but i'd trade it any day for more gameplay features on the PU alpha. There's little point unless CIG wants to risk another storm of backlash on releasing SM without the quality level and features the players expect.
I was never excited by SM - but I think it's a useful game mode for testing purposes. It will make the segment of players eager to master first person combat concentrate on that part of the game, and should produce some very useful results for CIG to reflect and react upon. Useful because they'll be concentrated and separate from the other parts of the game, which means finding the relevant bugs and balance issues should be a lot easier for the most part.
But I have to say I think the SC alpha release was vastly more interesting - and vastly more useful as "proof" that they could really do what they said they could do.
I mean, they're using CryEngine - a FPS dedicated engine. Did anyone really doubt they'd be able to deliver first person shooting at some point?
That said, I'm not really surprised a bunch of detractors use this "public missed delivery" as some kind of evidence CIG are liars and thieves.
The mindset that this is some kind of deliberate and malign plan or lie - with absolutely no perceivable upside - would be mindboggling to me, if I didn't feel I understood the nature of the detractors.
Comments
Feel free to go there and ask the question, however on my side i won't blame the backers for not wanting to keep beating up the dead horse on more threads about the same pointless speculation. People are tired of it.
Posts: 326
The forum users in CIG so scared of getting banned for saying the wrong thing.
https://forums.robertsspaceindustries.com/discussion/338907/what-s-your-feelings-towards-star-marine-presently
...He was directly baiting the moderators by doing that comment "Shhhhh you'll get a life ban for that". Don't tell me he is afraid of being banned at the same time making comments that will definitively bait a moderator who sees it to act. :P
Here is the forum to post the concern questions/discussions, btw best read the actual rules before, things as calling out by name individual employees on threads like that will not end up well.
Up the pace a bit.... got only 7 more days to rehash that year old "news". ;-)
Have fun
I do know what polls are but you seem to be wanting your cake and eat it too. You're choosing just the SC community where there is a clear bias and yet you tell me I'm the one being bias?
By definition, pre-release software is an incomplete product.
SC is an incomplete product.
As such SC can be legitimately charged back with no negative consequences whatsoever, despite your snark.
If the past is any indicator, the next two conventions will give us plenty of promises and gaffs to stretch for the next year.
You know that Chris is going to get going on something and put his foot in his mouth. He can't help it.
If you are holding out for the perfect game, the only game you play will be the waiting one.
Reminds me of http://boingboing.net/2016/08/10/in-private-dealings-trump-lie.html
A routine and habitual fabulist.
Not delivering on time due to significant plan changes is clearly a crime - and he should be punished severely.
Conclusively, what some of the more unreasonable detractors want is no change of plans for a game in full development - or that developers never mention their plans in public, for fear of missing an ETA. What does the E stand for again?
I find such demands quite amusing - not to mention as far away from reality as you could possibly get.
That's the kind of expectation you would have if you were a child - or a psychotic boss with zero understanding or empathy for how reality might actually get in the way of plans.
The poll that took the decision of the continuity of stretch goals back then, was also done on the site and only got replied by a fraction of the total backers, yet the majority of who voted still took the decision. You can argue all day "oh but not all the backers voted so it doesn't count" but it definitively did.
So i stand to my claim, that the majority of the backers of SC do not care about SM delays and the fact that it is still un-released. Specially not after the FPS dev being done with and within the PU dev on the main Alpha.
Many developers subject to a publisher green-light would never have been able to do that.
That's one of the best parts of SC development. The ability to change plans and improve the core of the experience - even if it takes longer and is more expensive. Most publishers are just like the detractors: they want results NOW - and they have no surplus of patience or tolerance for plans changing. They're basically children - wanting a return on their investment in the shorter term, no matter the outcome or long term result.
That some people believe CIG can't do basic math and that they don't have the money to do what they're planning - is only worthy of note if there's evidence to support such a negative claim. There isn't - and there never has been. Nothing but total speculation.
Is it possible that CIG don't know that 2+2 = 4? Sure it is, but I don't want to entertain such nonsense unless there's a tangible reason.
I'm speaking as an investor by the way.
I see SM as a cool feature but i'd trade it any day for more gameplay features on the PU alpha. There's little point unless CIG wants to risk another storm of backlash on releasing SM without the quality level and features the players expect.
So let's take seriously instead, random people saying random things on the internet!
Well if it fits the bias, why the hell not?!
But I have to say I think the SC alpha release was vastly more interesting - and vastly more useful as "proof" that they could really do what they said they could do.
I mean, they're using CryEngine - a FPS dedicated engine. Did anyone really doubt they'd be able to deliver first person shooting at some point?
That said, I'm not really surprised a bunch of detractors use this "public missed delivery" as some kind of evidence CIG are liars and thieves.
The mindset that this is some kind of deliberate and malign plan or lie - with absolutely no perceivable upside - would be mindboggling to me, if I didn't feel I understood the nature of the detractors.
It's almost painfully predictable, really.